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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | I am still a fairly new member here, I joined asking for help looking for a '58 Plymouth.
Well, now I have finally found one! This has been a very long time dream car of mine, ever since I watched Christine as a kid, right then, I said to myself, I'm going to own one of those someday.
I bought this '58 Belvedere 2 door hardtop from John at Big M on Friday the 13th (yes, I know!).
The car was last running in the '80s, then I guess an abandoned restoration then parked. The car is original, numbers matching, and rust free. John did have her running, but I still need to drain some very stinky bad fuel out before I will try to fire her up. She has a 318 poly with the torqueflite pushbutton automatic.
My restoration plans for her is that she's not going to be a Christine, sorry, but I feel that its time for some variety. But instead, a very cool '60s custom hot rod. I planned on red and black paint (black top, black stripe) and probably go with some metallic and pearl in it. The interior is going to be black and red tuck n roll. Wheels, I'm going to go for those 5 spoke Cragars, what was most popular in the 60s.
Here is some photos of her now.
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Veteran
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Not sure how to post photos... Said that they have to be under 500kb??? |
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Location: DFW, TX | 250kb 
Congratulations on finally getting that '58 Belvedere you've always wanted. Sounds like it will be a sharp car. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | How is the best way to downsize photos? |
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Expert
Posts: 3967
Location: DFW, TX | I struggle with this too. On any Windows machine, you can use MS Paint which has a really simple Resize operation. I'm sure there is something simple on an iOS machine as well.
On my Samsung phone, I actually had to download an app to do it. Crazy. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | 57burb - 2018-04-17 12:17 PM
I struggle with this too. On any Windows machine, you can use MS Paint which has a really simple Resize operation. I'm sure there is something simple on an iOS machine as well.
On my Samsung phone, I actually had to download an app to do it. Crazy.
Thank you, I tried that, hopefully you can see photos. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 705
Location: California | I bought that car in 1982 and drove it daily for a few years. I had paid 300.00. For it ran like a top and not a spec of rust. Good luck. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5006
| on Windows I use Paint.net its a nice photo editing software package and free.
https://www.getpaint.net/
nice car and clean, hah I bet you sold it for more than 300$ 
we all get lucky sometimes... |
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK | Congrats Jackie,,, Looks a great Solid project ,, Looking forward to its Build.. |
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Posts: 1172
Location: Georgia | Good score Jackie! Looks like a fine car, thanks for sharing with us--looking forward to the progress!
Pete |
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Location: Parts Unknown | I recognize those fenders ....
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Paul Hettick - 2018-04-18 11:53 AM
I bought that car in 1982 and drove it daily for a few years. I had paid 300.00. For it ran like a top and not a spec of rust. Good luck.
REALLY?!
Wow, awesome to be in contact with the previous owner! You're kidding that you only paid $300 for it?!
Please let me ask you a few questions about the car.
Do you know any of the ownership history?
Were you the one that sold it to a Mark L.? (then he later sold it to John)
Was she converted to a '57 before, or after you had it? Just trying to figure out how long its been like that, as it does have '57 holes drilled in rear, and I'm guessing those green fenders are 57s.
Thanks.
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Doctor DeSoto - 2018-04-19 2:16 AM
I recognize those fenders ....
Really, why? |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Forgot to post this from the start, just a little video taken when she was still at John's showing that she does run.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2JNwR2JjzM
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | 58Jackie - 2018-04-17 11:11 AM
How is the best way to downsize photos?
go to "paint", look for size, change percentage to get the required bytes. click save. and it should show you the change. if not correct; change the percentage up or down from that, then save again. Marc. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | It's a smart thing to get a video of it running. |
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Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | My car is mostly complete, but here is a list of the parts I still need. If anyone can help me out getting the parts, that would be awesome. Thank you.
Exterior:
Stock mirrors (outside)
Fin caps, both sides ('58)
Front center top valance panel (between bumper and grille)
Rear valance panel (under bumper)
Interior:
Trim over ashtray ('58 star pattern please)
Long dash chrome trim (over glovebox)
Rear window crank handle
Passenger side door panel metal armrest base
Door panel top metal rails (both sides front, passenger side rear)
Thanks, just let me know what you have that you'd be willing to part with. |
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Expert
Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | I have a pair of exterior stock mirrors for your '58 I has the hardware and the other does not I got them this way if You want them I will sell them for $100 for both plus shipping if not that is OK too. |
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Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | I will try to up load the photos of the mirrors. No Luck I will try again later my upload is being a PITA
Edited by 1961plymouthfury 2018-04-22 10:09 PM
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | 1961plymouthfury - 2018-04-22 8:55 PM
I will try to up load the photos of the mirrors. No Luck I will try again later my upload is being a PITA
Thanks Stephanie!
What type are they, the ones with the tall base or the other ones? |
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Expert
Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | Tail base 1s I believe. There are times I wish I grabbed a '58 plymouth instead of a '61 . my dad said the body would of been easier to work on. Watch the ethanol in fuel before you fuel up I would also keep a bottle of lucas ethanol treatment in the car with me in case I need it. These are the fender mirrors I was telling you about.
Edited by 1961plymouthfury 2018-04-28 4:30 PM
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Veteran
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | 1961plymouthfury - 2018-04-28 12:54 AM
Tail base 1s I believe. There are times I wish I grabbed a '58 plymouth instead of a '61 . my dad said the body would of been easier to work on. Watch the ethanol in fuel before you fuel up I would also keep a bottle of lucas ethanol treatment in the car with me in case I need it. These are the fender mirrors I was telling you about.
Thanks, I sent you a PM. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So I have been bitten by the hot rodding bug once again. I will most likely end up putting a 440 in this car. Can anyone please help me out with fitment details and any front end mods that I may have to do? Thanks. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7806
Location: Williams California | Good to see you here, Jackie!!
---John
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Location: Parts Unknown | Do you plan to drive this car ? How are you set up for funding ... trust fund,
born into royalty, well paid gigolo ? Because that 440 is going to have you filling
up 4x as much at the current $3-a-gallon than you will with a B-block or 318.
I love my go-fast 440-powered Coronet, but even with A LOT of thought and
money spent to lean out the fuel consumption, the 440 is just too large-lunged
to do any better than maybe 14mpg, and you can tank that to 4mpg if you like
to leadfoot it. So, it sits. Even my 1 ton truck gets better mileage than the old
Coronet !
The 440 is a great engine. Don't get me wrong. I would just caution anyone
considering one to really think through what they want to do with a car long term
before spending cubic dollars building a 440. I wish I had built a 383 instead.
near as much power and FAR greater ability to run with reasonable economy. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 705
Location: California | 318 will do 20+ mpg and give snappy performance. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Here is a little something-something about performance 318 polys:
https://cpwebstore.com/Poly
https://www.facebook.com/polysuperpac/
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/426-cube-318-poly-can-outgun-hemis/
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/strange-v-8-make-power-with-chrysler...
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/vintage-mopar-power-550hp-chrysler-p...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WL35IBm2ws
http://justacarguy.blogspot.com/2015/10/this-might-be-more-than-inc...
http://www.enginelabs.com/news/video-sam-engine-masters-challenge-c...
http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/poly318.html
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/mopp-0110-how-to-give-a-318-poly-eng...
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/318-poly-stroker-kit-402...
http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/poly-graphics.htm
http://www.moparchat.com/forums/performance-talk/75889-318-poly-402...
https://www.camcraftcams.com/catalogs-links/318-chrysler/
http://www.performance-mopar.com/index.php/content/1-cppa (repeat?)
http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/1783697/r...
http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=47515
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Location: Parts Unknown | The tech for making those little 318 Poly's scream has come a
long way in the past 10 years, AND they'll still hand out great fuel
economy. The 440, as much as I have tweaked it to go long on
gas mileage, just cannot get past it's massive displacement (air
movement) that requires fuel to make it work. Sure, it will melt
down a perfectly good pair of tires on command, even with my high
gearing and internal mods, but 14mpg is about as good as it gets
on the open road in 0.70:1 "overdrive" through 3.23's. To take it
the 300 miles to Seattle for an event means dropping $200 down
the filler neck to make the trip, maybe more if I don't lightfoot it
all the way. To my thinking, this really puts a damper on my enthusiasm
to take this car anywhere. I'd love to drive it down the coast to L.A.
with the top down, but I'd need a trust fund or serious lottery win
just to pay for the gas. The DeSoto, with 361, 4bbl, 2.91 gears,
906 heads, and a tweaked cam pushes that 5400 tub of iron nearly
20 miles for every gallon down the tube.
I'd be chatting Jim Rawa up (there are others) about building 318's.
They can do amazing stuff and not take a railroad tanker full of gas
just to get you to the event.
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | big m - 2018-05-05 9:53 AM
Good to see you here, Jackie!!
---John
Hi John! Yeah I'm here on the other finned mopar site, more info I can get the better. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Paul Hettick - 2018-05-06 10:04 AM
318 will do 20+ mpg and give snappy performance.
How much mpg did you get out of it when you used to own her? I do know that has got to be the most tiny 2 barrel carb I've ever seen, so probably pretty good mpg? |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Ok you guys have me sold for the time being on fuel mpg. This definitely wont be my daily driver, but I'd still like to take her out on some fun road trips once I get her road worthy.
I am going to try to fire her up (with the original powertrain) here shortly after I get done going through the fuel, motor fluids, etc. I may have to go through the brakes as well as they act like they're locked up.
After I do that, I can better answer if I will have to do a complete rebuild on it.
If I do have to rebuild, I will be wanting to put some performance parts in her, just so I can still have some fun, even without big block 440 power. So help with that would be appreciated.
Also, if I do decide to keep the 318 in (results from starting her up will answer that), can I bolt up a aftermarket auto tranny in (727)?
Not looking to keep the pushbuttons in, as we do have some mountains here where I live, I don't need my car to start driving herself down the hill when I park her in N... Even with the E brake, I have my doubts, as I already found out she does roll well in N with no E brake set. |
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Expert
Posts: 2196
Location: Muskego, WI | Your car already has a 3 speed TorqueFlite in it (assuming from the 5 push buttons on the dash), that is a good start. Having a true first gear at 2.45:1 ratio gives you better acceleration versus the 1.69:1 (or 1.67?) gear ratio of a 2 speed PowerFlite. It will also allow you to run a lower gear ratio in the rear for better economy. Consider the examples below.
My 1960 Plymouth had a PF and 3.31 gears, so overall ratio in 1st gear is 1.69x3.31=5.59. Final drive is obviously 3.31
Let say your car has 2.94 gears, that would give you an overall 1st gear ratio of 2.45x2.94=7.20. Significantly lower ratio to get the car moving, yet lower final drive ratio.
Now lets say you have 2.76 gears, now you're first gear is 2.45x2.76=6.76. Still much better launch ratio than a PowerFlite car.
I don't know what gear ratios came in the Plymouths with TF, but just about any gear ratio will out perform a PowerFlite car in both economy and acceleration.
If you want to get into overdrive, you have two basic options. One, find an original 3 speed manual with Borg Warner overdrive. This would be tough to find and a lot of work, but everything would "bolt up". Two, get an adapter kit and connect a modern overdrive auto to the engine. The trans tunnels one these cars are fairly huge, so you probably don't need to make more room. Then you need to modify cross members, linkages, drive shaft, parking brake and so on. This is also a lot of work, so your best bet might be to maximize what you have. Keep in mind that your 318 is good for 230 hp and over 300 foot-pounds of torque (with a 2 barrel carb), those are not bad numbers, and the TorqueFlite is a great transmission. |
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Expert
Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | I am not sure about the after market transmission bolting on You can give it a try but would keep the original motor and transmission in the car. You can put a 1 of those 2x4 s in front of 1 of the tires of the car and that should stop it from rolling. If the E brake needs to be replaced call Andy Bernbaum he might have a kit its worth a shot.
I have a suggestion on the color of the car how about black and red
The top black between the chrome black and the rest of the car red.
I was going to repaint my '57 Savoy that way but it never happened because of the a**hole causing me to total her back in '87 |
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Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Thanks for the info about the tranny.
Why I have my doubts against it is cause a while back I was wanting to see how well it went into all the gears. I am not sure if this is a typical problem with the pushbuttons, but they got stuck behind the trim piece when I put it into gear. I tried, theoretically speaking, that it would "pop back out" once I selected another gear. Nope! It proceeded to have that gear stuck as well.
I then tore it apart and found why the buttons were stuck.
It seems that the plastic buttons simply slide onto the metal shift linkage. With the force of the shifter popping the button back out as you select another gear, the button gets flung right off of the shift linkage, and then falls down and jams up behind the trim piece. I watched this happen when I had taken off the trim piece and went through the gears.
Is this a common problem, and how is the best way to fix it? Glue the buttons to the shift linkage or what? |
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Expert
Posts: 2196
Location: Muskego, WI | Your buttons may be broken, but a good disassembly, cleaning, light lubing and reassembly might be best. |
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Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | jboymechanic - 2018-05-16 10:44 PM
Your buttons may be broken, but a good disassembly, cleaning, light lubing and reassembly might be best.
No, I don't believe that they're broke unless there is supposed to be clips holding the buttons on the shift linkage better. As what it looks like, they're only held onto the shift linkage by simply sliding onto it.
It only did this once, but I was just worried about it happening again when I have her on the road. I don't exactly want to pull over on the side of the road and re-install the buttons each time they decide to pop off the linkage, doesn't sound fun!
Is there any good solution? Maybe glue them on? |
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Expert
Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | this will show were you can get ethanol free gas.
https://www.pure-gas.org/
A texaco is closest to you but its 87 but with as car like that I would burn 93
Edited by 1961plymouthfury 2018-05-17 5:53 PM
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Veteran
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | 1961plymouthfury - 2018-05-17 4:47 PM
this will show were you can get ethanol free gas.
https://www.pure-gas.org/
A texaco is closest to you but its 87 but with as car like that I would burn 93
Thanks. I already have a regular fill up station here in town that is ethanol free that I use for all my cars.
You think that the poly would run best on premium? |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | I have been doing a lot of detail work to her, making her look nicer. Here is some photos to show.
Now that I've got her looking better, I am now working on trying to get her running. I've already cleaned up the motor compartment and removed all the rat turds. Hopefully this weekend I will get new hoses on, fresh oil in, flush out the radiator along with the fuel tank (may have to drop the tank to properly clean it), then (fingers crossed) she fires up.
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7806
Location: Williams California | Looks 100% better!!Nice job! |
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Expert
Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | Good luck you also might want to change the plugs, wires and points . You might want to consider converting to electronic ignition
Edited by 1961plymouthfury 2018-05-23 5:03 PM
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | big m - 2018-05-23 3:06 PM
Looks 100% better!!Nice job!
Thanks John! |
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Veteran
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | 1961plymouthfury - 2018-05-23 3:52 PM
Good luck you also might want to change the plugs, wires and points . You might want to consider converting to electronic ignition
Yep, I know for sure the wires as the protective silicone is gone in spots. As for the distributor, I know for sure she ran when John had her, so I'm going to try to fire her up with the stock equipment. I do plan to convert over to a better ignition system later though. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Well, here is some bad news as far as getting her running. I ran into some REAL BIG problems.
When I replaced the old hoses on the motor, I found some bad rust residue inside them (and falling out in rust flakes).
As I removed the upper radiator hose, the water neck was very rusted and eaten through at the top. There was so much rusty stuff on top of the thermostat that you couldn't see it. When I cleaned it out, I pulled the thermostat. More rusty stuff inside the motor. NOT GOOD!!
I then decided that it would be a good idea to flush out the radiator and block before going any further.
I first flushed out the radiator, and found out some bad news as it leaks down by the bottom seal. Ok, bad, but not as bad as what I found out about the block...
Now, time to flush out the block. I did this by flushing out the water passages. Pouring water down the water neck hole, hopefully it would come out the outlet of the water pump. Key word= hopefully.
No, where did it come out. Here is the bad news.
It turns out that I have more than one open freeze plug hole.
When I poured water down the water neck hole (inlet), i found all the water hitting concrete from the rear of the block, passenger side. Freeze plug hole.
There is another freeze plug hole that i can see open at the front of the block, drivers side.
There is at least 2 open freeze plugs, maybe more. Why?! I have no idea.
All i know is this motor needs to be pulled to get to them. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | The freeze plugs either popped out when the block froze or rusted away and fell out. You have a video of it running? I didn't. I was working on my car anyway so I removed my left fender and exhaust manifold to get to my trouble spot.
Edited by mstrug 2018-06-11 6:57 AM
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Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | You would be probably be better off taking down the motor and rebuilding it. I would probably do the same with the transmission |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 8443
Location: Perth Australia | Freeze plugs can be got at with the engine in, but it is hard (I did this on my dodge)
There isn't much room and you will need to remove the engine mounts and other bits and pieces
I used 2 hammers to reinstall the new plugs, 1 was an old claw hammer that I had to cut the claw off to make the head shorter
The engine meeds to be jacked up a bit to give room and buy more than 1 set, so if 1 or more pop back out, you have spares to put back
Good thing is, they are cheap.
I also found that the steel ones were better than the stainless steel ones (they kept popping out)
Have fun, its an awkward, messy uncomfortable job, but unless you really want to pull the engine, I wouldn't
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 8443
Location: Perth Australia | Just read the rest of it, I wish you well with your project
As for the engine choice, the 318 can look pretty nice without it costing "too" much (nothing cheap about this era mopar) and go well enough to satisfy most urges
If you want to be the fastest car on the street, thats a whole new can of worms
The trans should be ok, but may need resealing (fatsco have all the seals in a kit) as for the buttons, go buy some felt and make new seals that go around the buttons, its the seals that stop them falling off.
This engine was basically a stock build except for a very mild cam, the 2x4 set up and electronic ignition
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Posts: 2196
Location: Muskego, WI | Don't be discouraged, your engine is telling you it's time to be cleaned out. This should be viewed as a good preventative maintenance exercise. Thoroughly flush the block while poking around inside the block with a long screw driver, you will be impressed by the amount of crap you get to fall out. Keep flushing and poking until the water comes out clear (at least mostly). Then fill it up with coolant and rust inhibitor and you'll have piece of mind. |
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Expert
Posts: 2633
Location: Minor Hill, TN | I ran premium in my poly 318 before that I was running low grade so 1 day I decided to try premuim and it ran a lot smoother. I always run a higher octane fuel in my classic cars. I ran it in my '57 Plymouth, my previous '61 fury and plan to run it in this '61 .
Edited by 1961plymouthfury 2018-06-12 2:51 AM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 705
Location: California | Jackie , I sent a pm with my phn #. I'm the prior owner. Can help with some issues and have some fun stories of that car. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | mstrug - 2018-06-11 5:52 AM
The freeze plugs either popped out when the block froze or rusted away and fell out. You have a video of it running? I didn't. I was working on my car anyway so I removed my left fender and exhaust manifold to get to my trouble spot.
Yes, I had a video of it running. It was taken about a year before I bought the car.
Judging by how much rusty crap is in the motor and around the freeze plug holes, I'd say it had plain water in it for some time and that's how most of the damage happened - including the freeze plugs. There is 2 missing, one on passenger, the other on the drivers side. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | ttotired - 2018-06-11 3:55 PM
Freeze plugs can be got at with the engine in, but it is hard (I did this on my dodge)
There isn't much room and you will need to remove the engine mounts and other bits and pieces
I used 2 hammers to reinstall the new plugs, 1 was an old claw hammer that I had to cut the claw off to make the head shorter
The engine meeds to be jacked up a bit to give room and buy more than 1 set, so if 1 or more pop back out, you have spares to put back
Good thing is, they are cheap.
I also found that the steel ones were better than the stainless steel ones (they kept popping out)
Have fun, its an awkward, messy uncomfortable job, but unless you really want to pull the engine, I wouldn't
As I just want to hear the original motor run before I decide if it needs a total rebuild or not (may go with a 440 then); I will be going with the temporary screw-in type freeze plugs. I dont have all that much room to swing a hammer to get the press in type in, just barely enough room to get a wrench in there.
I would probably have more room if I took the whole front end apart, but I want to do that about as much as I want to pull the motor - not very much. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | ttotired - 2018-06-11 4:23 PM
Just read the rest of it, I wish you well with your project
As for the engine choice, the 318 can look pretty nice without it costing "too" much (nothing cheap about this era mopar) and go well enough to satisfy most urges
If you want to be the fastest car on the street, thats a whole new can of worms
The trans should be ok, but may need resealing (fatsco have all the seals in a kit) as for the buttons, go buy some felt and make new seals that go around the buttons, its the seals that stop them falling off.
This engine was basically a stock build except for a very mild cam, the 2x4 set up and electronic ignition
I do want to hear the original motor run first, and to tell me if it needs a total rebuild or not.
If it will need to be rebuilt, I am planning to build a 440 to put in it, in the neighborhood of 500 horses.
Where did you get the cam at for your motor? I researched that you have to have a special one custom made?
As for the pushbuttons, you must've read above that I had the pushbuttons fall out when I went through the gears.
When I worked on that, it does have the felt gasket. It seems that where the point of them falling of at it when the plastic indicator piece clips onto the metal shift linkage. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | jboymechanic - 2018-06-11 9:37 PM
Don't be discouraged, your engine is telling you it's time to be cleaned out. This should be viewed as a good preventative maintenance exercise. Thoroughly flush the block while poking around inside the block with a long screw driver, you will be impressed by the amount of crap you get to fall out. Keep flushing and poking until the water comes out clear (at least mostly). Then fill it up with coolant and rust inhibitor and you'll have piece of mind.
I was attempting to do that when I learned (the hard way) that I had the 2 freeze plugs out. I had already flushed out the radiator (it leaks too) and moved onto flushing the block out by pouring plain water down the water inlet.
Made about one of the biggest messes in my garage when all the water starts flowing out of the freeze plugs. I did have a bucket under the water pump outlet, no water even bothered to flow out where it was supposed to.
I plan to flush it out more when I have freeze plugs back in. Hopefully I find no more leaks then. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So I've moved (for the time being) onto getting the fuel system straightened out as I still had the little bit of bad fuel still in the tank. I am still going to drop it as the stuff that came out was disgusting, so I will need to properly flush it out.
Few questions...
Is it ok to hot tank the fuel tank?
Is the sender (most likely should replace) the 73-10 ohms?
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Expert 5K+
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Location: So. Cal | The sender should be 15-200 ohms. You can get new ones with the proper range through Vans on ebay. But make sure it lists that range on there as people try to sell the smaller range versions to us. |
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Expert 5K+
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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | There are fuel tank shops out there, check the radiator shop ads too. they will clean them if feasible. Other wise Vans has one for $275.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-57-58-59-Chrysler-300-gas-tank-fuel-t...
Edited by mstrug 2018-06-25 12:40 PM
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Powerflite - 2018-06-25 8:39 AM
The sender should be 15-200 ohms. You can get new ones with the proper range through Vans on ebay. But make sure it lists that range on there as people try to sell the smaller range versions to us.
I didn't find too many options for that 15-200 ohms sender.
Is it possible to go with a different ohm reading, as I do plan to use aftermarket gauges (except speedo) anyhow. |
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Location: So. Cal | If you have an aftermarket gauge, then use a sender that matches it. But Vans does sell a sender in the 10-70 range too. |
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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Oh Reeeeaaallly:
Says Chrysler, but will work. Don't buy one for a wagon and you will be o.k.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-58-59-Chrysler-Mopar-Fuel-Tank-5-16-Se...
NOS: See how it fit all our cars...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-NOS-1957-59-Plymouth-Dodge-59-Windsor...
Edited by mstrug 2018-06-25 4:52 PM
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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Another:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-1958-1959-Chrysler-5-16-Fuel-Sending-U... |
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Location: So. Cal | The last one you posted that doesn't specify the resistance range, is the lower 10-70ohm version. If it doesn't explicitly state that it goes to 210 ohms, it doesn't. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Powerflite - 2018-06-25 12:24 PM
If you have an aftermarket gauge, then use a sender that matches it. But Vans does sell a sender in the 10-70 range too.
Ok thanks! That's a great help!
I do plan to use aftermarket gauges, except the speedo. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | One of the many steps into getting her running is the fuel. I know John had her running off an external can, most easiest way, and I'd probably do the same if it weren't for something that I'll have to do anyhow.
So I'm in the process of getting the tank out.
A long dragged out process, as this car's personality is down right STUBBORN on everything.
I already tried using the nut/bolt to remove the tank. It seems that how the straps are curved next to the bolt, there's no way you can get a socket on it. An open end wrench gets stuck against the strap.
I tried forcing it, ended up in a losing battle, as the bracket that's secured to the body twisted up badly. The bolt however, didn't budge.
Now I'm getting serious. Or some may say, mad, at this bolt.
Out comes the hacksaw and I'm working at these 2 bolts. I don't want to take a grinder to it, as its so close to the tank.
Wow, gotta love rusted/froze on bolts. |
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Location: Williams California | Jackie,
Have you drained the tank? If there's still fuel in the tank it may come crashing down when you cut the 2nd bolt,
There is a drain plug in the bottom of the tank, it takes a 1/2 inch drive ratchet to remove, or use a short extension on your ratchet for extra clearance. Be sure to have a pan or bucket ready!
You'll need to remove the rubber grommet at the fuel fill, to allow the filler tube to slip downwards, also have the car jacked up substantially so you can remove the tank with the tube attached from beneath the car, it will be easier to remove the filler tube once it's out of the car, on something that has set this long.
---John |
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Posts: 1150
Location: Southern California | My 2cents don’t do a 440
There gray engines don’t get me wrong but unless your building a race car I wouldn’t bother . I had a 440 build for my 58 and it’s cool and all but more problems than it’s worth. I’m having the darnest time keeping it cool. She runs hot in traffic or a hot day.
Personally if I could do it over I’d build a 318,361,0r 383 tops all day long |
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Location: Southern California | Congrats great find by the way |
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Posts: 1150
Location: Southern California | Typo sorry meant
Great engines |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | big m - 2018-07-06 10:22 AM
Jackie,
Have you drained the tank? If there's still fuel in the tank it may come crashing down when you cut the 2nd bolt,
There is a drain plug in the bottom of the tank, it takes a 1/2 inch drive ratchet to remove, or use a short extension on your ratchet for extra clearance. Be sure to have a pan or bucket ready!
You'll need to remove the rubber grommet at the fuel fill, to allow the filler tube to slip downwards, also have the car jacked up substantially so you can remove the tank with the tube attached from beneath the car, it will be easier to remove the filler tube once it's out of the car, on something that has set this long.
---John
On the drain plug, its recessed in there (female end) where I'd have to get a special type tool to get it out. I tried that, but the problem is, its a star like pattern on the plug, and the tool I got is a standard. It wont work...
What type of tool do you use?
I used a siphon pump to get most of the stuff out of the tank. (it was only about a 1/2 gallon)
I'm using jackstands to hold the tank up while I'm cutting the bolts. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | bad58mike - 2018-07-06 3:00 PM
My 2cents don’t do a 440
There gray engines don’t get me wrong but unless your building a race car I wouldn’t bother . I had a 440 build for my 58 and it’s cool and all but more problems than it’s worth. I’m having the darnest time keeping it cool. She runs hot in traffic or a hot day.
Personally if I could do it over I’d build a 318,361,0r 383 tops all day long
What core size of radiator are you running with the 440? |
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Location: Williams California | The drain plug is an eight-point type, use the square end on a 1/2" drive extension or ratchet, it'll fit perfectly. |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 977
Location: Sydney, Australia | Finally got your dream car and looks like a good one.. Still have your 59 Chev?
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | FUEL TANK FUN!
So I finally managed to get the fuel tank out by cutting the bolts. Unfortunately, I damaged the brackets the straps attach to. They're severely twisted around in the direction that I was trying to loosen the bolts. I don't trust the integral strength of them anymore (already thin poorly designed bracket to begin with), and I for sure don't want the tank falling out when its full of gas.
So I plan to get a welder out there to weld on a good L bracket; one side welded to the body, the other side hanging down in place of where the original bracket was.
My other more serious problem is that I found a little surprise when I dropped the tank. First off before I say this, this car has zero rust anywhere; been in Sacramento CA her whole life as far as I know.
So I have a golf ball sized rust hole in the tank (you can see inside the tank) and a 5 inch area around it that's sacrificed (very spongy metal). Its around the filler tube.
I'm still unsure how the tube removes from the tank, but I don't want to even try now as it would most likely rip out all that surrounding metal. You can move the tube without much pressure and watch the metal on the tank move with it. Its very bad...
I'm going to have it hot tanked to 1 remove all the crap that's in the bottom of the tank (initial plan), and 2nd to remove the loose rust.
Plan A with this tank is see if I can salvage it and have it welded.
Plan B is a good suitable "new" tank.
By the way, the area around where the rust is on the tank, there is absolutely no rust on the floorpan. You can still see some shiny good metal. Makes me wonder....
Edited by 58Jackie 2018-07-23 12:19 AM
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | big m - 2018-07-18 10:34 AM
The drain plug is an eight-point type, use the square end on a 1/2" drive extension or ratchet, it'll fit perfectly.
Wow, now I'm mad at self as I drained it the much harder way before I dropped it! I used a siphon hand pump that worked, but not fun.
I now know why I couldn't get that plug out. I was using a 9/16 size large allen wrench. A no-go......... |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | matte - 2018-07-18 10:42 PM
Finally got your dream car and looks like a good one.. Still have your 59 Chev?
Thanks Matte! Yeah my dad took the 59 over, now his, I don't have time for that anymore now with this. Must say, this is my dream car and that makes it much more fun. |
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Expert 5K+
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Location: So. Cal | If the tank is that bad, you will be better off purcahsing a brand new one for $275. You can get them from Vans Auto on ebay. The only issue with them is that the inlet that the pipe goes into may be too small, and needs to be opened up a little to fit the pipe in there properly. So try it out ahead of time, without the gasket.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-57-58-59-Chrysler-300-gas-tank-fuel-t...
Edited by Powerflite 2018-07-23 9:08 AM
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Powerflite - 2018-07-23 8:05 AM
If the tank is that bad, you will be better off purcahsing a brand new one for $275. You can get them from Vans Auto on ebay. The only issue with them is that the inlet that the pipe goes into may be too small, and needs to be opened up a little to fit the pipe in there properly. So try it out ahead of time, without the gasket.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-57-58-59-Chrysler-300-gas-tank-fuel-t...
Thank you! I already contacted John (Big M ) to see what he's got for a factory one.
That one on ebay, says 23 gallons. Wasn't the factory ones 20 gallons, or am I mistaken? Edited by 58Jackie 2018-07-25 12:55 AM
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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | I believe 2 tanks were offered.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/9-pc-Fuel-Tank-Tank-Bracket-Fill-Seal-Set-f... |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Thanks Marc; I believe I have a tank for me from John.
Edited by 58Jackie 2018-07-27 1:00 AM
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | I'm at a sort of slow period as far as posting progress because I am stripping off the undercoating and years of accumulated road debris on the underside (probably from when she was daily driven) to get it ready for paint. There's no rust to deal with, but the road grime doesn't look too pretty... I figured that with the tank still out, it was the time to do some cleaning up.
The undercoating brings me to another question... My car only has undercoating from the rear axle back. There is no undercoating from that point forward. It appears to be factory this way, as you can see the undercoating underneath the frame areas where the car has been undercoated, but there it has not there is no undercoating even under the frame.
Anyone else's cars like this??? |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | I will be replacing the steel fuel line that runs from the tank to the pump in the near future. Does anybody know if there is a pre formed line kit out there or am I going to have to make one myself? Any good suppliers out there that you guys recommend?
So what about the routing issue? I've seen that its one very long one piece unit; any good tips from those that have done this the best way to do it? Would sectioning up the steel line and joining it by rubber line in the curved areas be an ok idea? |
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Location: North Australia | Hey Jackie, thanks for the update, keep the posts coming.
Look here for pre-formed fuel and brake lines for your car. You might want both? You get to choose either steel or stainless.
Steve,
https://www.inlinetube.com/brake-fuel-lines
Edited by 60 Imp 2018-09-03 6:36 AM
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | 60 Imp - 2018-09-03 5:34 AM
Hey Jackie, thanks for the update, keep the posts coming.
Look here for pre-formed fuel and brake lines for your car. You might want both? You get to choose either steel or stainless.
Steve,
https://www.inlinetube.com/brake-fuel-lines
Thanks!
Yes they do have pre formed lines for a 58 Belvedere. I will be redoing the fuel system first, then onto the brake system; they have the lines for both, so good news there.
Does anyone know the proper factory size for the fuel line? I thought it was a 1/4" size (could be wrong), and inline tube has a 5/16" size listed. I'm confused... |
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Location: So. Cal | Factory size is 5/16". |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Sadly, working on Christine again wont happen soon. I was in the process of replacing the long fuel line and put the new tank in. Then put disc brakes in, and work on the drivetrain and install a 440/727 tranny.
I was working dedicatedly on this as I am REALLY looking forward to getting her running under 440 power.
But NO! My daily driver, 86 Caprice, took a crap (other words, but cant use here). I am without my own wheels currently the original dog 305 went to burnt black toast over the past week of driving it to/from work. I wouldn't call it even driving, more of the less limping along 25 mph or less as that's all she'll do. Now wont even do that, cant get the thing out of the driveway without it dieing.
I thought I was just having carb issues as I had rough idle, shuddering (shakes the whole car), missing, stumbling, dieseling on and stalling.
I replaced the carb with a new one and had the exact same issues even after adjusting the idle and mix screws, if not worse.
Not carb. Something not very good? definitely.
To the list of problems, I had valve guide seals going if it hadn't run in a while it would always go away after a minute or so.
Now it doesn't go away, and not upon startup either. Now it burns oil badly when the rpm increases. That only tells me one thing, that I have piston rings that are shot.
I know that this isn't a joking matter as this was my only car for daily transportation and now I'm screwed, but what all the bad smoking my car is doing reminds me of the Christine movie when Christine was smoking super bad. My car is doing that now, if not worse. I felt like someone was going to call the fire dept. on me as I was getting very funny looks from passerbys.
Now have to spend the time putting a 350 in it as these 305s were real junk even when running right. I don't want to get rid of this car as it does mean something to me that I bought myself (that my dad didn't buy for me hoping I'd give up Christine, that's what the 59 chevy was).
It just means that Christine has to be put on hold for a couple months before I can get my daily fixed.
Just letting you guys know whats up when you haven't heard anything of the progress with Christine................
Just letting you guys know whats up |
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Location: So. Cal | Make sure you have the right amount of oil in the motor. My hemi acted the same way when I accidentally had 12 quarts of oil in it. |
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Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | While tinkering on my 58, in the interior I noticed some bits of clear yellowed plastic. On some of the larger bits the shape of them seems to fit in with the shape of the 2 center metal strips/pieces that hold up the cardboard headliner.
On mine, all I have is just bare metal strips. Originally was there clear-ish plastic covering them (the bits remaining that I've found)?
Does anyone have photos of how they look with the plastic covering still on them just so I can see what it used to look like, thanks.
I'm thinking that its near impossible to find the plastic covering now, so has anyone resorted to just painting or chroming the metal strips? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Those strips should be plastic. They get brittle with age. Andy in Germany used to make them, ready to paint or plate with spray chrome. Old ford vans had a roof/ceiling strip very close to ours also and may be found in salvage yards.
https://www.christinecarclubforum.com/t4414-do-it-yourself-headliner
Edited by mstrug 2019-01-06 7:22 AM
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Expert
Posts: 2905
Location: little rock, AR | Keep the faith. That original motor will serve you well so don't give up on original just because of some freeze plug issues. Original motor won't require Premium Non-Ethanol fuel like a 440 will. Just remember the turtle finished first. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | oldwood - 2019-01-06 8:34 PM
Keep the faith. That original motor will serve you well so don't give up on original just because of some freeze plug issues. Original motor won't require Premium Non-Ethanol fuel like a 440 will. Just remember the turtle finished first.
I'm not giving up on the original. I will be keeping it for a later rebuild date. I talked to a machine shop about it and the 318 polys cost a lot more than a 440 will to rebuild because of the issues with the valvetrain being different than the LA 318. The poly 318 is more closer related to a hemi's valvetrain.
One of the main other problems I am worried about is I have a good amount of rust in the block. So much so I am scared of the internal strength of the block of the cooling passages around the cylinder walls. |
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Location: California | The last time that car was driven is when I owned it. It drove it everywhere and it was mechanically as strong as an ox. The only issues it should have are those from being parked in a garage for 30+ years. |
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Location: Minor Hill, TN | Paul is right the car needs to be driven . |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Paul Hettick - 2019-01-12 8:50 AM
The last time that car was driven is when I owned it. It drove it everywhere and it was mechanically as strong as an ox. The only issues it should have are those from being parked in a garage for 30+ years.
Yeah I've given it a lot of thought of what we talked about. You're right, if that motor was good as you say, I should pop those 2 freeze plugs back in and flush it, and run it and see how she does.
What I was thinking of doing so I don't have to pull the motor is using the expandable bolt in freeze plugs; I've looked at the location of the freeze plugs, I'd probably be able to do it this way.
Technically, I could try to start her up right now dry, just for only a short time just to see how she does, as that is what John did back in early '17. There's a video of that on youtube, she actually did sound decent and I didn't see any smoke. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Is there any adjustability to the trunk latch to make it operate nicer?
My problem is that whenever I close the trunk, I have to really slam it hard (I don't like doing that) for it to latch. If not it'll pop back open.
Here is where it gets tricky; I can hear the latch engaging (clicking) when I shut the trunk, and I can hear the latch click again when it pops back open. Slamming it has been mostly successful but even then sometimes it'll pop back open. The other weird thing is that sometimes it doesn't pop open instantly, I have gone out there the next day and found the trunk open.
My best guess is that the latch is too loose, causing the latch mechanism to not have a good hold onto the trunk lid. Why I was hoping there would be some adjustability here. |
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| could be worn a bit, was it ever rusted? it is adjustable (i think from under the trunk). Sounds like its barely catching.
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Posts: 4037
Location: Connecticut | IIRC, the latch adjusts side-to-side and up-down. Look under the trunk lid. Probably needs at Type 3 Phillips head. Also the latch catch is adjustable. This is likely where your problem is. Loosen the two bolts holding the latch catch a bit. Then close the trunk lid gently. The latch will move the catch into position. Then lift the lid and retighten. You may have to play with it a little. Ron |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | mikes2nd - 2019-05-30 12:41 PM
could be worn a bit, was it ever rusted? it is adjustable (i think from under the trunk). Sounds like its barely catching.
Is not rusted, it actually still is coated with the factory gray paint that's in the trunk. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | ronbo97 - 2019-05-30 3:06 PM
IIRC, the latch adjusts side-to-side and up-down. Look under the trunk lid. Probably needs at Type 3 Phillips head. Also the latch catch is adjustable. This is likely where your problem is. Loosen the two bolts holding the latch catch a bit. Then close the trunk lid gently. The latch will move the catch into position. Then lift the lid and retighten. You may have to play with it a little. Ron
Thanks a lot! I will try what you advised. Hopefully it helps! |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So I tried to move the latch downward slightly. But what the problem is that apparently from what I discovered, someone had this problem in the past as the latch is already moved to its lowest setting. I can see scratches in the gray paint from where the screws were previously.
I'm sort of in a stuck spot here, but what I thought of is enlongating the holes so I can move it more downward. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7806
Location: Williams California | A small diameter rat-tail file works well if you need to elongate the slots slightly.
---John |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So I did more adjusting on that trunk latch, finally got it adjusted correctly. Apparently, I wasn't loosening the screws up enough, so that was the problem why it wasn't adjusting. Glad I didn't have to elongate the holes. I'm amazed at how well it turned out compared to how bad it was before. It shuts so nicely and easily now, even better than my daily driver! You can just push down on it and it clicks closed. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So I need to know the correct stock wheel size. I'm planning on putting aftermarket wheels on my car soon, on the front I'm putting on the exact stock wheel size. The current tires that are mounted on my car are from the 70s, so it was in the days before tire manufacturers printed the tire size on them.
Can someone please go look at their car's tire dimensions for me? That's what I'm after here, the dimensions that are printed on the tire sidewall. Thanks. |
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Location: Lower Mainland BC | 58Jackie - 2019-07-28 9:41 PM The current tires that are mounted on my car are from the 70s, so it was in the days before tire manufacturers printed the tire size on them.
What are you talking about? Even in the 50's there were tire sizes marked on the tire. Just not the way they are today.
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | What I meant was that it only gives a letter-number- 14 on the tire. Now they give you all the info size you need printed on it. I wasn't around in the 70s when tires were like that so I had no idea of how to convert it to todays tire sizing.
Thanks for the conversion chart. |
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Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So I got some progress done to her, I dug out a couple pieces of trim that wasn't on my car and installed them, mainly the side trim. It makes her look more like a Belvedere should now, so I'm happy about that.
I didn't have the factory clips for the trim, so I fabricated new ones. For the restorers out there, here is a friendly tip/solution to when you don't have the factory trim wire clips.
I used a simple fender washer (same diameter as trim), flat head fine thread screw and nut. One of the more important things is to make sure its a low profile/flat head screw that you can find or else it'll never fit into the gap provided on the trim where the clip goes. Also get an assortment of washers to see which one fits the best. For the screw, I used ones that were slightly smaller than the holes to allow for adjustability.
I then attached the screw to the inside of the washer and slid it onto the trim. It fits tightly so I recommend using some lube while sliding the new fabricated clip onto the trim; I learned this the hard way when getting the clip stuck. It then slides around easily, a nice thing when getting it aligned on the car. The biggest pain with these is getting the nut on the backside, but you can do it with patience. Once tightened down the clip will no longer slide around and the trim will be very secure. Compared to the factory clips, this actually holds the trim much more firmly onto the car. I noticed a little bit of wiggle/looseness with the trim that's held on with the factory clips.
Again, just a hopefully helpful piece of info for the restorers out there.
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Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Hi Jackie; There are clips out there with threaded studs. Those spring clips were used at the factory for easy of assembly. There may be some you won't be able to get a nut on and the spring clip will work there, a new one won't be as brittle or loose as 60 year old clips. Marc.
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trimclip.jpg (6KB - 217 downloads)
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Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | mstrug - 2019-09-09 4:06 AM
Hi Jackie; There are clips out there with threaded studs. Those spring clips were used at the factory for easy of assembly. There may be some you won't be able to get a nut on and the spring clip will work there, a new one won't be as brittle or loose as 60 year old clips. Marc.
Where did you find those threaded clips at Marc? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Here are a few:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=si...
https://www.auveco.com/chrysler
https://www.google.com/search?q=BODY+SIDE+CLIPS+NUTS+AUVECO&client=f...
https://www.clipsandfasteners.com/automotive-clips-s/219.htm?searchi...
https://www.clipsandfasteners.com/Fasteners-s/90.htm?searching=Y&sor...
Marc.
Edited by mstrug 2019-09-11 6:56 AM
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | https://www.bresco.com/
https://www.vintagepartsource.com/bodytrim.htm
http://www.allensfasteners.com/search_results.asp?iLevel=2&subcat=3...
http://www.hillcofasteners.com/cat/Automotive-Clips-and-Fasteners/U...
https://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_mercury_passenger/universal-mould...
https://cliphouse.com/clipsandfassteners.aspx
https://www.autofastco.net/universal_mldg_fasteners.html
https://www.oreillyauto.com/search?q=universal+clip+moulding
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=10433556&jsn=14&_nck=Ekt...
https://www.rockauto.com/en/tools/body,retainer+/+clip,molding+retai...
https://www.zoro.com/auto-body-doctor-molding-clip-chrysler-10-24x34...
Marc. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | So i need a few of you to chime in with photos please. What i need is a pics of what the factory keys look like so i can get new ones made. No, i do not have my cars keys, getting new ones made but I'd like to see what the factory design of them look like so my new ones look close to original as possible.
I know that some of you may be wondering what happened here, long story, but i havent had her keys since I've owned her. I bought my car from John at Big M, and from what John told me is that some kids must've came and stole the keys cause he couldnt find them. I searched the entire car, taking out/looking under the back seat, everything, and no keys to be found.
Now fast forward, I have been cleaning up her motor, the 318 Poly, and getting her ready to fire up. But now i am in obvious need of the last thing, the keys!
So if some of you could please show me a photo of what the original keys look like so i can have new ones made that would be greatly appreciated. I'm not sure if the design of the keys differ from a Dodge, etc. to my 58 Belvedere or not? Also, i'd like to see a photo of the ignition switch as the slot on mine is facing downward, I'm unsure if this is correct or not?
Thanks, it will be greatly appreciated. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 9664
Location: So. Cal | Originals were made from aluminum, but I don't recommend them. They won't last for everyday use, or in the winter time. New brass reproductions have a forwardlook symbol like some of the original applications (depending on the car). And there are specialty keys on Ebay too. A '70's key will work in a forwardlook ignition switch without any issues, but the problem is with the door locks. The newer design key won't engage the old door locks all the way so they won't work. Key design changed slightly in the early '60's and again in 1968. The only place I have found to get original style key blanks that work in the doors is from ebay or a key blank source online. Look at the link at the end of the forwardlook page for an example.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/CHRYSLER-FORWARD-LOOK-Logo-KEY-Blank-SET-19...
http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=7743 |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Anyone else? Please????????? I do really need to see a couple photos of the ignition/door lock keys to get a reference both for me and the locksmith. Just need to see the head design of it. Thanks. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | https://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-MOPAR-DODGE-DESOTO-OEM-TRUNK-GLOVEB...
67327112?hash=item4da4339a88:g:YBMAAOSwqQpeEl5Z&vxp=mtr
. https://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-1958-MOPAR-Pentastar-KEY-blank-SET-Ply...
Edited by mstrug 2020-01-28 8:11 PM
 (195758dodgekey.jpg)
 (195758plykey.jpg)
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195758dodgekey.jpg (41KB - 176 downloads)
195758plykey.jpg (172KB - 171 downloads)
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Ignition: " These are Grv. 26 keys,"
https://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-Mopar-Dodge-Plymouth-Chrysler-Key-Blank...
Edited by mstrug 2020-01-28 8:14 PM
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | Part Brand:
Ilco or Briggs & Stratton For Chrysler Corporation
Surface Finish:
Brass with nickel plating
fits:
300 New Yorker Fireflite Adventurer Fury Belvedere
Manufacturer Part Number:
1704K, 1701G
Country/Region of Manufacture:
United States
Other Part Number:
fits most MOPAR vehicles 1957-58, TRUCKS 1958.
Interchange Part Number:
Fits 1957 1958, also 1966 1967
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1957-1958-MOPAR-Pentastar-KEY-blank-SET-Ply... |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | https://www.ebay.com/itm/Two-NOS-OEM-Mopar-Dodge-DeSoto-Knight-Logo-...
5296?hash=item5d8d8d2220:g:Iu0AAOSwefldIG5m&vxp=mtr
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Hey thanks Marc!!!!!!!!!! Exactly what i needed to see, as my locksmith just wanted me to show him what the head shape of the key is, so that he can get a close match to original. Thanks again. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7207
Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada | 58Jackie - 2020-01-28 2:24 PM
Anyone else? Please????????? I do really need to see a couple photos of the ignition/door lock
keys to get a reference both for me and the locksmith.
Just need to see the head design of it. Thanks.
Jackie,
I've been a member of this forum for 20 years or more and have been a locksmith for 48 years.
I can make keys for your locks if you send them to me. I have equivalent ILCO blanks in stock to make them.
You can check my company web site here https://acmesafe.ca/services/vintage_auto_finished_projects.html |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | imopar380 - 2020-02-04 8:36 PM
58Jackie - 2020-01-28 2:24 PM
Anyone else? Please????????? I do really need to see a couple photos of the ignition/door lock
keys to get a reference both for me and the locksmith.
Just need to see the head design of it. Thanks.
Jackie,
I've been a member of this forum for 20 years or more and have been a locksmith for 48 years.
I can make keys for your locks if you send them to me. I have equivalent ILCO blanks in stock to make them.
You can check my company web site here https://acmesafe.ca/services/vintage_auto_finished_projects.html[/QU...
Hey wow, thank you for that! Will definitely keep you in mind if the locksmith I'm dealing with now fails on me. So that is actually your company, on the link? So the address (815 Fort St. Victoria, BC ) is where I'd be sending the locks to?
Can i send the whole complete lock, or disassemble it, for the door/trunk lock and ignition?
Do you have any original type (CPDD, or Forwardlook logo ) key blanks to use? |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Doing a tune up on her before starting, i was replacing the coil today, and dumb me cant remember (i got distracted) about the positive/negative wires on the coil and which ones what. So need a little help; there is 2 wires, same color, one is thinner gage and goes into the main wiring harness. the other is thicker gage and goes directly into the bottom of the distributor. Which wire is for the positive/negative on the coil? Thanks.
Like i said, dumb me for not marking them, i usually do, but got distracted with something else.
Oh, and on same topic, I will be putting in new plugs too, what do i gap them to (318 poly) 0.35????????? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | The battery hot wire from the ignition switch goes to the + side of coil. Plug gap is .035''.
Edited by mstrug 2020-02-15 10:15 PM
 (coil.jpg)
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coil.jpg (39KB - 194 downloads)
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | Thanks Marc! I found it odd that the negative wire is thicker gage than than the positive side, probably what confused me. Wish i had this reference to look at earlier, now i just have to go redo it and swap those wires back around, but oh well, the price i pay for not paying close enough attention when i pulled the old coil. That old coil was actually an Autolite, likely the original from 58. Surprising that it hasnt been changed until now. |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | I'm now on the last step of getting her ready to fire up, which is the keys. I dont have the original keys for the ignition/doors/trunk, so I'm having new ones made.
I've got the ignition and trunk lock out without any issues, but the main problem now is the locks in the doors. i spent a whole day fighting them and they wont come out. I can tell there is a slider type bracket (same as trunk sort of) so i slid it out to where it looks like the lock should come out, the lock was loose in the door, but it just wont pull out.
I have no idea what is going on, but can you guys offer some advice? I'm really hoping this doesnt turn into a nightmare to get these door locks out, as they will need to come out later when getting ready to paint her. |
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Expert
Posts: 4037
Location: Connecticut | I assume you have the door panel off. Shine a light inside so that you can see what is involved. You need a long screw driver to pop the horse shoe clip off. Once off, the lock will be loose. You have to wiggle it out. The pin at the end may be hung up a bit. Use the inner door handle to lock/unlock the door and you will see what is causing it to hang up. You may be able to free up the pin from inside the door shell using, again, a long screwdriver. Ron |
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Expert
Posts: 4037
Location: Connecticut | Also, regarding your ignition key issue, it may be easier to find a used 57-8 Plymouth ignition switch that comes with the key included. Just swap out the switches and you'll be good to go. From there, you can have the tumblers in the door locks changed so that they work with your ignition key. Ron |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | ronbo97 - 2020-02-29 7:40 PM
I assume you have the door panel off. Shine a light inside so that you can see what is involved. You need a long screw driver to pop the horse shoe clip off. Once off, the lock will be loose. You have to wiggle it out. The pin at the end may be hung up a bit. Use the inner door handle to lock/unlock the door and you will see what is causing it to hang up. You may be able to free up the pin from inside the door shell using, again, a long screwdriver. Ron
Thanks. Does that horseshoe clip, i called it a slider pin, come all the way off? On the trunk one, that one was in a u-shape horseshoe, but the door lock one is square. About the door one, i was able to slide it to one side, where it looked like it wasnt interfering with anything. The lock was loose in the door, was able to pull it out a little, but the upper portion of the lock was catching on something. Is there another pin catch thing up top that I'm not seeing? |
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Expert
Posts: 4037
Location: Connecticut | Hmmm...it may be a slider, rather than a horse shoe. Can you see what it is getting caught on ? If you can wiggle the inside door handle ( the one that opens the door) while pulling on the lock, it may free up. It's been over ten years since I had to do this. So memory is a bit fuzzy. Ron |
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Veteran
Posts: 123
Location: Southern Idaho, USA | I just got an aftermarket complete ignition switch for my car.
its slightly different though, my original connections read
IG ACC ST AM
the new one is this,
IG ACC ST and BATT
As you can see the only one that changed is the originals AM, to the new ones BATT. Do these mean the same thing? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 6500
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth) | AM is probably AMP Meter (ammeter)
These days Volt meters are more in Vouge.
Read this:
https://www.americanautowire.com/view-faq/a-word-about-ammeters
Fury Jim (James Rawa) makes volt gauges that look like our gauges. He is on FB on the Forward look group.
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4_posn_universal_ignition_switch_wiring_diagram.pdf (99KB - 173 downloads)
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