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57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?
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firedome
Posted 2018-01-31 3:26 PM (#557279)
Subject: 57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?



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Location: NY & VT
In '57 to '59 the "Senior" Chrysler/DeSoto cars had bolt-on Aluminum door window frames, and Dodge had 1 piece steel integral door window frames.

Did Windsor & FireSweep (the "Junior" editions of Chry & DeS) use the 1 piece door frame , some of them being Dodge built? '57 Windsor was Chrysler built, '58 Windsor was Dodge built, '59 Windsor I don't know. '58 DeSoto was Dodge built, '57, Dodge? '59 I don't know. So what years of 57-59 Windsor and FireSweep used the 1 piece Dodge steel door window frame? All my go-to reference brochures are inaccessible at the moment. It's a bit confusing!!


Edited by firedome 2018-01-31 3:30 PM
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57desoto
Posted 2018-01-31 5:14 PM (#557285 - in reply to #557279)
Subject: Re: 57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?



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For 1957 DeSoto, Firesweep sedan window frames are as you suggest, painted steel. Only the Firedome/Fireflite used the aluminum ones.
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Powerflite
Posted 2018-01-31 11:37 PM (#557313 - in reply to #557279)
Subject: Re: 57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?



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I can tell you for certain that the lower models, regardless of '57 Windsor vs. '58 Windsor, used the steel window frames. However, they were not a 1-piece door. The steel window frames unbolt from the door just like the aluminum versions. The only difference is the material they are made from - plain steel vs. ribbed aluminum.
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firedome
Posted 2018-02-02 2:16 PM (#557392 - in reply to #557279)
Subject: Re: 57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?



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Thanks for the info. So evidently all Firesweeps 57/58/59 were Dodge built, only 58/59 Windsors were Dodge built, 57 Windsors were "real" Chryslers and were Chrysler built but still had steel window frames like the Dodge cars.

So 57 Windsor frames were bolted on, according to info here, but I think Dodge window frames were 1 piece with the door, integral or welded on?

Edited by firedome 2018-02-02 2:20 PM
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Chrycoman
Posted 2018-02-04 10:37 PM (#557528 - in reply to #557279)
Subject: Re: 57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?



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The 1957, 1958 and 1959 Chrysler Windsors (in the US) used the one piece doors as shared with the Firesweep and similar to those used on Plymouth and Dodge. The one-piece doors had the upper frame integral with the lower section of the door.

First, the Firesweep and Windsor shared bodies with their bigger brothers. Remember, the 126" wheelbase DeSoto and Chyslers could use the same bodies as the 122" wheelbase models as the extra 4" was all in the hood, not the body, as ut was for Dodge over Plymouth.

Body panels for 1957 -

Roof - 4 door sedans -
1681 600 - Plymouth and Dodge
1681 604 - DeSoto (all) and Chrysler (all)

Roof - 2 door hardtops -
1681 605 - Plymouth and Dodge
1681 605 - Fireflite, Adventurer, New Yorker, 300-C
1683 019 - Firesweep, Firedome, Windsor, Saratoga

Door shells - front -
1755 708-9 - 122" wheelbase - Dodge, Firesweep and US Windsor
1759 078-9 - DeSoto (except Firesweep) and Chrysler (except US Windsor)

Door shells - rear
1759 084-5 - Dodge (122" wheelbase)
1759 088-9 - DeSoto (except Firesweep) and Chrysler (except US Windsor)
1759 104-5 - Firesweep, US Windsor

Rear Quarter Panels - Sedan -
1706 444-5 - Dodge (122" wheelbase)
1757 468-9 - DeSoto (All)
1757 574-5 - Chrysler (All)

Rear Quarter Panels - 2 door Hardtops -
1706 788-9 - Dodge (122" wheelbase)
1757 474-5 - Dodge (All)
1757 542-3 - Chrysler (All)

The Canadian 1957-58 Windsor was actually a Saratoga with a 2-bbl carb and Windsor nameplates.

ALL Detroit-built 1957-1959 Chryslers were built at East Jefferson, including Windsor. None were built at Hamtramck. 1957-58 DeSotos (except Firesweep) were built at Wyoming Ave. and in 1959 at East Jefferson. Only Firesweeps were built at Hamtramck with Dodge. Dodges, Firesweeps and Chryslers were built at Los Angeles 1957-1959, but not the 126" wheelbase DeSotos. 1959 was the last year DeSotos were built at LA, and 1960 was the last year for Chrysler and Dodge Polara at LA.

No 1957 DeSotos were built at the Windsor plant and only Firedome models in 1958-59. Fireflite, Adventurer and 1957 Firedome models were imported. Firesweep models were not imported as they were in the same price range as the Dodge Custom Royal. The Adventurer was the only DeSoto built and sold in Canada for 1960 - and with Saratoga upholstery and door panels.

By the way, Hemmings Classic Car has a nice article on pre-war DeSotos. Except they have the dealership info wrong. DeSoto (priced between Plymouth and Dodge in 1928) had their own dealers at the start in Canada and the U.S. In 1930 all Dodge and DeSoto dealers added Plymouth so DeSoto dealers became Plymouth-DeSoto. In 1931 all Canadian dealers were Plymouth-Dodge with DeSoto and/or Chrysler being added if wanted. In 1933 Dodge and DeSoto swapped places in the corporate hierarchy. Thus DeSotos in the U.S. were now built at the Chrysler plant on East Jefferson instead of the Plymouth plant.

In the U.S. things continued on with Plymouth-DeSoto dealers, and did not join with Dodge as HCC states. In 1959 the DeSoto Division merged with the Plymouth-Valiant Division to form the Plymouth-DeSoto-Valiant Division. The Valiant part was dropped in 1960 and DeSoto was dropped after DeSoto production ended. And shortly after that Plymouth was merged with Chrysler to form the Chrysler-Plymouth Division. Chrysler was paired with Plymouth at dealers already (since 1928) so the former Plymouth-DeSoto dealers became Chrysler-Plymouth.

Going back to Canada, from 1933 through 1960 DeSotos were sold at Dodge-DeSoto-Dodge Truck dealers. Valiant was added for 1960. No DeSoto or Dodge Polara models for 1961, so the dealers became Valiant-Dodge-Chrysler-Dodge Truck. The other dealership in Canada was Plymouth-Chrysler-Fargo Truck. Fargo Truck was added in 1936 and Valiant for 1960. The Valiant was the only Chrysler compact built and sold in Canada 1960-1966. The "Valiant" name was dropped from all dealer signs for 1967 when the Dodge Dart and Plymouth Valiant were shipped to Canada from US plants. Windsor built Plymouth and Dodge C-body models for the U.S. and Canadian markets.
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firedome
Posted 2018-02-05 9:18 AM (#557542 - in reply to #557279)
Subject: Re: 57-59 4 door sedan door-window frames question?



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Wow thanks Bill! , as usual comprehensive and authoritative information. Chrysler Corp didn't make it easy to keep it all straight!

So as I originally thought, the steel window door frames were an integral stamping or welding with the lower door and were not just bolted on. Seems like a more solid, tight and rattle-free way to made a door and window, but considered not as dressy by the marketers, it seems.

Edited by firedome 2018-02-05 9:19 AM
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