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1961 floor shift cars
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tailfins
Posted 2009-05-12 7:30 PM (#174001)
Subject: 1961 floor shift cars


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Location: calif		i've seen several 1961 chrysler newports with the 3speed floor shifts
could you get a dodge phoenix in 61 with a 3speed floor shift stick?
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imopar380
Posted 2009-05-12 7:34 PM (#174002 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Victoria, BC, on Vancouver Island, Canada		All the Dodges came with a three on the tree if it was manual shift. The reason Chrysler used the floor shift, was because the astra-dome panel and column assembly provided no room to mount a column shift lever. They didn't even use a turn signal lever on the column of these, it was over on the dash below the trans buttons.
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Sonoramic60
Posted 2009-05-13 7:25 AM (#174066 - in reply to #174002)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars


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The heavy-duty 3-on-the-tree in '61 was a lousy trans as it kept bending, or even shearing, synchro pins during high speed drag strip runs and would have to be repaired at least once even during a single drag session. At the 1961 NHRA Nationals, the Ramchargers '61 Dart (413 CID ram-inducted Dart) lost on the S/S trophy run because of such a failure. However, they did repair it in time for a "grudge" match with the winning car (an early 409 CID chevy) which Jim Thornton won. The photo of that Dart beating the Chev made all the car magazines in short order.
Incidentally, a buddy of mine had a '60 Belvedere with the 325 HP 383 CID mill (single 4V carb) and the stick and he also had problems with it, eventually putting a Hurst floor-shift conversion unit on it.
Joe Godec
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-14 2:22 AM (#174160 - in reply to #174066)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		My crossram / stick DeSoto used the floor-mounted shifter. I never hammered it so hard as to break the tranny, but I did break a number of clutches before getting set up with a 12 incher. Never had a mechanical problem with it after that. I did have continuous problems with metal fatigue around the shifter hump, as this unit truly is "floor mounted", with all pivot action being borme against the sheetmetal of the floor. In 63, Hurst made a transmission-mounted unit to replace this type. I have one that I took out of a 58 Plaza. I had intended to retro-update the DeSoto with it, but plans changed and I sold all my 60's to focus on the 58's.
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dukeboy
Posted 2009-05-15 12:40 PM (#174290 - in reply to #174066)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Sonoramic60 - 2009-05-13 7:25 AM

The heavy-duty 3-on-the-tree in '61 was a lousy trans as it kept bending, or even shearing, synchro pins during high speed drag strip runs and would have to be repaired at least once even during a single drag session.
Joe Godec


Joe, You speak the truth here, as Schaefer with the 350 GC Plymouth Sedan has had this problem more than once in his own car....He once even had the famous "Wendel Scott" weld his shifter mechanism on the steeering column back together for him at his shop....
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tailfins
Posted 2009-05-15 5:09 PM (#174327 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars


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Location: calif		Thanks for all the info
I now realize that my 61 D500 orig had a column shift,which i'd like to put back to the orig configuration
which years,models' columns,trannys would interchange?
i assume 60-61 dodge,plymouth?
6 and 8 cylider?
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-15 7:22 PM (#174334 - in reply to #174327)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Chuck, since your ride is a civilian D-5, it almost certainly had the column shift.

However, a floor shift was technically available on 61 Dodges, according to the Hot Rod and Motor Life magazine
articles on the '413' D500's.

And, I want to say (from memory) that the floor shifts were from Hurst.

According to Darrell Davis' 61 D500 research, only TWO 413 Seneca-post column-stick D500's were ever built, and both
were basically in-house produced, for advertising purposes: the red car (as seen in the two articles) and a black one (for
East coast publicity purposes).

The black car's whereabouts is unknown, but the red car may still exist.





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Sonoramic60
Posted 2009-05-16 7:45 AM (#174376 - in reply to #174334)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars


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Neil --
There also was the Ramchargers' Pioneer 2-dr h/t (it might have been a Phoenix, but the photos I've seen of it are at distance and I can't spot any emblems or see the rear window). The Ramchargers modified it quite extensively, i.e., NHRA legal over bore, 12-to-1 pistons, special cam, tuned headers, and, of course, the "short" long rams.
Cotton Owens, Richard Petty's father-in-law, also got a couple of stick 413 Darts for the NASCAR circuits.
I don't know what happened to any of these cars but most likely they were junked as they were ridden hard and put away wet.
Incidentally, photos of the restoration of Petty's '60 NASCAR Fury show show the "3" still remaining on the tree.
Joe Godec
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-16 1:24 PM (#174403 - in reply to #174376)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		As I understand it, the floor pan mounted ORIGINAL type shifter was a Chrysler made device. Old heads told me the Hurst-made / tranny mounted shifter did not come along until 1963 as a replacement unit for the originals, as these became really sloppy and problematic in operation due to sheetmetal fatigue and cracking that allowed the whole shifter to wobble every which way without moving the shift rods. I have examples of both still and based on my stick DeSoto experience, the floors did crack and the Hurst unit was a far better idea !
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Sonoramic60
Posted 2009-05-16 2:49 PM (#174412 - in reply to #174403)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars


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Doc --
An "adversary" of mine who had a '60 Plymouth 383 with the 1X4V carb and a 3-on-the-tree went to the Hurst unit -- and while it was quite a bit AFTER(!) the '60 model year, though I can't remember exactly when, I believe it may have been late in '61 or early '62, but at my age, who knows?
Joe Godec

Edited by Sonoramic60 2009-05-16 2:51 PM
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-16 3:22 PM (#174421 - in reply to #174412)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		I'd better go dig out those issues of HR and ML.......
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-16 7:05 PM (#174444 - in reply to #174412)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Joe ~

Don't shoot .... I'm just the messenger !

My old DeSoto got quite a bit of attention on account of the floor shift stick ..... all the usual know-it-alls saying they only came with push buttons, etc. But it did draw out an occasional oldtimer who was there and of age to have been paying attention to such matters. I was told the floorpan mounted shifter began to show problems after a year or so of use and hence the Hurst unit was developed. "1963" was tossed out there as what someone remembered, but I didn't ask for documentation !

I can collaborate that the floor did crack after extended use like the oldtimers said it would - this was after I replaced a rotted floor with good metal - and I began looking for a Hurst unit to replace it with. I found the Hurst unit in a 58 Plaza, of all things ! Apparently the one-time owner put it in for whatever reasons and left the the tree shifter hanging !

I guess we could call that a double-shifter ???
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Sonoramic60
Posted 2009-05-17 7:01 AM (#174486 - in reply to #174444)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars


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Doc --
I wasn't shooting; heck, I'm not even loaded!
Joe
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-26 10:50 AM (#175457 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Here are some pics from the Hot Rod mag Neil was talking about. Also, the 1961 Ram Chargers car was a Pioneer hard top. I have a video somewhere with it. (and more pics besides this one) I want to say the video is the Lyon's Drag Strip early years or something . . .

Edited by B/G 61 2009-05-26 12:46 PM




(Hurst kit.bmp)



(Hurst.bmp)



(Ram Chargers.bmp)



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Attachments Hurst kit.bmp (225KB - 274 downloads)
Attachments Hurst.bmp (225KB - 266 downloads)
Attachments Ram Chargers.bmp (225KB - 265 downloads)
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-26 11:12 AM (#175463 - in reply to #175457)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		What you are showing there is decidely NOT the shifter I have and have been told is a Hurst. Hmmmm ......

Mine has a flat bar "U' configuration through which the shifter shaft is bolted. This pic shows a single casting. Also, my mounting parts are made of 1/2"+ bent steel strap with holes (much like plumber's strap). A well manufactured unit, but very different from this one !

This is a great thread !
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-26 8:05 PM (#175543 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Thanks, Yikey.

What do you suppose a complete Hurst shifter set up, like the one seen, here, would go for, on the 'Pay?





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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-26 9:48 PM (#175556 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Well, that just might be the item that gets listed under "rat rod" and sneeks by everyone for $20.00 (but ends up on a ford pick-up with the shift levers tossed in the scrap pile) OR, that also might be the item that has a reserve of $10,000 (or some number that only a government bail out could hit) OR, I waaaait till the last second and SNIPE it for $600 . . .
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MOPAR-TO-YA
Posted 2009-05-27 12:45 AM (#175580 - in reply to #175457)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars


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B/G 61 - 2009-05-26 9:50 AM

Here are some pics from the Hot Rod mag Neil was talking about. Also, the 1961 Ram Chargers car was a Pioneer hard top. I have a video somewhere with it. (and more pics besides this one) I want to say the video is the Lyon's Drag Strip early years or something . . .
I am pretty sure the shifter shown here is a Spark-O-Matic. I don't know how they came up with that name, but was fairly common back in the day....................MO
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Kenny J.
Posted 2009-05-27 1:00 AM (#175581 - in reply to #175580)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Las Vegas, Nevada		I remember Spark-O-Matic also sold CB radios.

K.
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-27 1:18 AM (#175584 - in reply to #175581)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		OK, I am getting confused (happens easily with this pea brain!).

Does the above article showing the shifter "kit" actually say it is a Hurst shifter ? If so, is that accurate ?

What is a Spark-o-matic ? Is that a company ? Is it a Hurst model ? I have never heard that name before as it relates to shifters.

If I can lay hands on my "Hurst" shifter, I will take some pix and post them. Since I have torn down all but the last garage in order to build my new shop, my storage unit is overflowing and disorganized and I may not be able to find it (?). I guess I need to really look it over hard for a Hurst marking. I do not think I ever saw one on it, and was referring to it as a Hurst because old dog Mopar guys simply told me that is what it is.

I can tell you mine looks nothing like that unit pictured above and if one of these is a Hurst, I'd like to know what the other one is.
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-27 12:05 PM (#175637 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		It absolutely says Hurst floor shift conversion kit in the article - now that may pertain to the brackets and linkage only and not the shifter itself. The shifter itself may be a Spark-o-matic or some kind of J.C. Whitney something - I will look at it again when I get home and post what it says . . .
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-27 2:03 PM (#175642 - in reply to #175637)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		..without looking at the article, right now, my memory-cells tell me that the article specifically states that the shifter
assembly is a Hurst-brand item.






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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-27 4:48 PM (#175664 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		The article continues as follows . . . "We also installed a Hurst three-speed floor-shift conversion kit, which is a recommended option by Dodge, to promote smoother and faster shifting." It also says when describing the pic above . . . "Another "suggested" option for Dodge is the Hurst floor shift coversion kit to fit the heavy-duty three speed transmission. All brackets and parts are included in kit to make neat installation and eliminate column linkage." Upon a closer look, the word Hurst can be seen going down the shaft of the lever in the familiar "Hurst" way. You can't make it out in the pic here, but in person, I can see it.
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-27 10:00 PM (#175704 - in reply to #175664)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Yikey, et al, youse guys might want to check out the "Birmingham AL" car auction thread, over on the Craigslist message
board.

On page 9(?) of the auction listings is a certain 1961 Dodge that ya'll might wanna go look at....

I've asked the auction house for the car's VIN, to see if it's an OEM D500, or not.






Edited by d500neil 2009-05-27 10:01 PM
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-27 10:13 PM (#175709 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		I saw that car at Carlisle last year. (maybe two yrs now?) ANYWAY, as I recall, the guy wanted $12,500 for it. He had it on Ebay once too. Wanted a Ford truck for trade or cash. The body was rough in a few spots and I question the hydrolic 4 speed. PLEASE keep me (us) posted as to the "real-ness" of this car. He was calling it a 413 Max wedge . . .
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-28 12:50 AM (#175726 - in reply to #175709)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		What is the date on that magazine article about the Hurst shifter kit ?

If it is 1961, then that is the earliest reference I have seen of that round shift shaft with the flattened sides that reads "HURST" in incused letters. By 1968, Mother Mopar made that unit standard fare in her muscle cars. I fit one of these into my Coronet.

********************************

Getting back to the shifters I have .... I went up to the shop and dug through the DeSoto and found my two stock shifters from 60 and 61. I could not locate the unit I have always known to be a "Hurst". Bummer, because this is a favorite topic for me and I am stacking up the contents of my garage in that place to empty it and demolish it to make room for the new shop. It could be a while before I get all this stuff out and organized in the new shop.

I took a photo of the two shifters I did find and will post her shortly. I have some other stuff to do, but will get to it as soon as I can.
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MOPAR-TO-YA
Posted 2009-05-28 1:00 AM (#175727 - in reply to #175580)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars


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MOPAR-TO-YA - 2009-05-26 11:45 PM

B/G 61 - 2009-05-26 9:50 AM

Here are some pics from the Hot Rod mag Neil was talking about. Also, the 1961 Ram Chargers car was a Pioneer hard top. I have a video somewhere with it. (and more pics besides this one) I want to say the video is the Lyon's Drag Strip early years or something . . .
I am pretty sure the shifter shown here is a Spark-O-Matic. I don't know how they came up with that name, but was fairly common back in the day....................MO
Spark-O-Matic was a company that sold several things that the car crowd would be interested in. Among them were floor shift conversions and 8 track tape players. I think JC whitney sold a lot of their stuff. I am sure that at least the handle and knob is a Spark-o-Matic. The flat chrome lever has a "yo-yo" looking laminate knob in dark colored wood.. I have never seen a Hurst with a design even close to the one pictured. But then I don't think I have ever seen a Hurst made befor 1962. A lot of people called every floor shift conversion a Hurst--kinda like calling every cola sody pop "Coke"...............................MO
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 6:04 AM (#175743 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Oct 1961 Hot Rod Magazine -



(hrdp_1961_10_z+hot_rod_cover.jpg)



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Attachments hrdp_1961_10_z+hot_rod_cover.jpg (244KB - 245 downloads)
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-28 11:25 AM (#175767 - in reply to #175743)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		October, 1961. Hmmm ....

So really, we are talking about reporting on last year's (1961) cars and/or the just coming out 62 models.

Most of my old moterhead buddies from those days are dead and gone. I'll have to ask around about this Hurst thing. Interesting discovery for me !

Now, I am really curious to know what that shifter is that I was told was a "Hurst". Thinking back on it, I recall being told it was a "Super Stock" part, MADE by Hurst. I guess before we had Mopar Performance, they called their go-fast parts division "Super Stock" ?
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-28 4:29 PM (#175813 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Just went back to the auction site (it's shown on page 10 of the listings), and the listing says that it's a 383
engine.

There WAS a 1961 383 Rammie option, called, simply, the "D500" (as opposed to the "Super D500"(413 single-4)
and the "Super Ram Induction D500"(Rammie 413).

I'd be a lot more excited about the car's prospects if it, at least, sported a D500 emblem on its ass end.

I'll bet that it's really got a 3-speed trannie, but, if the car is a clone, a 4-speed would be a driving-plus, for it.







Edited by d500neil 2009-05-28 4:55 PM
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-28 4:36 PM (#175814 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Yikey, do you have (access to) the similar Motor Life issue, that discusses the 413 Rammie Seneca?

Both articles were prepared around June/July 1961, for publication in late-ish Sept.

Darrell Davis' research book has reported that there were two 'stick' 413 Senecas built; the red one for the West coast, and a black one for the East coast publicity usage .

This car might be a 383 Rammie D500 (it certainly is stripped-enuf!) but, its VIN will tell-all.

Still haven't heard anything back, from the auction house, regarding its VIN.






Edited by d500neil 2009-05-28 4:57 PM
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 5:04 PM (#175816 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Well I can tell you what the guy at Carlisle told me. He said it was a 413 max wedge (cardboard sign). I never looked at the engine bay (there was a crowd around it so I went directly to the guy behind the wheel as he fired it up for everyone) He got out of the car as he was telling me he didn't know too much about the car. He said he took it to a few car shows and the crowd around it is much like the crowd that was around it at that time. He said its a hydraulic clutch 4 speed enforcer package car. That was what someone had told him. I was going toward the back to check for the infamous D 500 emblem when he told me how he was a body and fender guy and how solid the car was. I am NOT AT ALL CLOSE to a body and fender guy but could CLEARLY see the "swipes" of mud/putty/bondo on the lower rear driver side quarter/rocker panel that I continued on to the back of the car, didn't see the emblem, said good luck and went on my way. I wish I would have went back to look under the hood but I never made it back. (413/elbows/exhaust manifolds/inner fender cut-outs I do not know) Yes I do have the Sept Motor Life . . .

Edited by B/G 61 2009-05-28 5:14 PM




(sept.bmp)



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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-28 5:09 PM (#175817 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Well, whatever this car might be, according to its clutch pedal condition, it HAS been 'run' often, and hard.

Funny; no seat belts in it, apparently.

Even if it's a clone, a retro-macho seat belt would be a nice feature to have on it.






Edited by d500neil 2009-05-28 5:12 PM
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 5:21 PM (#175819 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Sorry guys - I realize this is getting off topic but . . . The D500 in the pic above is not heater delete like the auction car and has anyone ever come across a steering wheel like this ? (same car)(sorry for the bad cell phone pic)

Edited by B/G 61 2009-05-28 5:28 PM




(wheel.bmp)



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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-28 6:18 PM (#175824 - in reply to #175819)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		This ain't off-topic.

That steering wheel is probably generic-cop/Corp issue.

Remember, that the heater, like the radio, was/were optional items.

That's what makes the auction car interesting; only in the deep south/west would someone be interested in getting a car without
even a heater in it, and/or unless the car were going to be raced regularly.






Edited by d500neil 2009-05-28 6:19 PM
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 7:51 PM (#175832 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Neil, I was not aware of Dodge in 61 making ANY ram car other than the 383 (no 361 or 413) I'm talking production off the line not a dealer install. I'm looking in my books now so if I am wrong I will try to beat you in correcting me !!!
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 8:04 PM (#175835 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		All info I have (memory and "as of now" gleaned papers) is the Power Package 318 (single 4 bbl) 361 Dart D500 (single 4 bbl) 383 Polara D500 (single 4 bbl) 383 D500 (ram car) . . .

Edited by B/G 61 2009-05-28 8:09 PM
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-28 8:33 PM (#175838 - in reply to #175835)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		Yikey, the HR & ML issues/articles discuss the 'availability' of the 413 engines, IIRC.

As I mentioned, the factory apparently only made TWO of them, however.





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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-28 8:37 PM (#175841 - in reply to #175835)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Here is a photo of the shifters as promised. The white ball unit is from my 60 DeSoto. The grey unit came out of a 61 Windsor.

Because the white ball unit is removed from the rest of the mechanism, it is slightly twisted by the ball raising one end to give the appearance they have a slightly different curve, but I believe this part is identical to both, with the exception of the knob.

The complete unit is just how it came out of the car, and shows the piece of plywood used in the mounting. This is stock, as Ihave seen it in every one of these cars I have had the chance to look at.

You will note that the curve of the shifter lever is not near so hooked as the one shown for the Valiant.



(60-61 Shifters.jpg)



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Attachments 60-61 Shifters.jpg (141KB - 240 downloads)
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 9:05 PM (#175844 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Not to add more confusion, but is the white ball a DeSoto only thing or was it used throughout the line-ups ??? (1960)
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-28 9:15 PM (#175846 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Neil, I have Darrell Davis' 1961 D500 guide and it says . . . "The 383 CID D500 engine was the only ram induction engine offered for 1961."
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MOPAR-TO-YA
Posted 2009-05-29 12:15 AM (#175868 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars


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Posts: 5139
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Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA		Far as I know-- the first Max Wedge was in 1962 as a 413-easily identified by the staggered two four barrels on a short cross ram intake ( no ram tubes.) Also had cast exhaust manifolds that arched up beside the valve covers. they ere called Stage I. Next Max wedge was called a Stage II It looked the same but was 426 wedge head,. They were replaced by the 426 Street Hemi. Super Stock refers to the NHRA drag racing class that these cars competed in, and Nopar made these cars to compete in that class. No Mopar Performance division like now-- just a knowledgeable parts man.........................MO
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-29 5:51 AM (#175886 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: RE: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		That is pretty much why I did not climb all over that car when I saw it at Carlslile. Calling it a max wedge, telling me it was soilid , I figured the guy was crazy and truly did not know what he was talking about. Oh well, that is only about the BILLIONTH time in my life I would like to "go back and start over" Someone once called a long ram car in front of me , now make sure you are sitting down , " An old Hemi Cuda motor with the offset carb's"

Edited by B/G 61 2009-05-29 9:07 AM
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Ray Bell
Posted 2009-05-29 9:55 AM (#175905 - in reply to #175886)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Dalveen, Queensland, Australia		Hey... that's the first issue of HRM I ever bought!

Not only that, it's the first ever US or British magazine I ever bought...

And I don't think there were any '61s with 4-speeds, were there? The Pont-a-Mousson (yeah, I know, it's probably not how it's written or spelled) was a 1960 option and not many were built, were they?
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wizard
Posted 2009-05-29 11:18 AM (#175924 - in reply to #174001)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+

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Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island		I cannot help laughing about this topic ... it's sooo totally uncool to have a mismatched stickshift on a overkool pushbutton FL car. I can make one exception only - the 300 F with 4 speed, because the stickshift was nicely integrated in the consol. The FL cars where not supposed to be muscle institutes - you where supposed to play them like a tenor saxophone - with buttons and feeling.
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-29 11:19 AM (#175925 - in reply to #175905)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown		Ray,

You got the spells right.

Yes it was a 60-only thing and,

No, not many were built.

The story I got with my old DeSoto was that Mopar replaced the P-a-M option with the venerable old 3-speed and this razzoo new floor shifter ..... neither of which were really that razzoo.

Still, to have a floor shift Mopar in a field of pushbuttons is pretty special !
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B/G 61
Posted 2009-05-29 6:17 PM (#175971 - in reply to #175924)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown
wizard - 2009-05-29 11:18 AM

I cannot help laughing about this topic ... it's sooo totally uncool to have a mismatched stickshift on a overkool pushbutton FL car. I can make one exception only - the 300 F with 4 speed, because the stickshift was nicely integrated in the consol. The FL cars where not supposed to be muscle institutes - you where supposed to play them like a tenor saxophone - with buttons and feeling.


I think Jim Thornton, (and the rest of the Ram Chargers) Ray Brock, Norman Thatcher, The Granatelli's, Lee Petty, etc. might disagree. Besides, my 1960 D100 has a 4-speed !!! AND YOU HAVE NEVER HEARD ME PLAY THE SAX ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

Edited by B/G 61 2009-05-29 6:31 PM




(Paxton-2.bmp)



(Bonnie.bmp)



(Paxton-3.bmp)



(Paxton.bmp)



(Ram Chargers-2.bmp)



(LEE PETTY.bmp)



(4-on-the-floor.jpg)



(D100.jpg)



(buttons.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments Paxton-2.bmp (225KB - 243 downloads)
Attachments Bonnie.bmp (225KB - 243 downloads)
Attachments Paxton-3.bmp (225KB - 239 downloads)
Attachments Paxton.bmp (225KB - 253 downloads)
Attachments Ram Chargers-2.bmp (225KB - 242 downloads)
Attachments LEE PETTY.bmp (225KB - 232 downloads)
Attachments 4-on-the-floor.jpg (90KB - 256 downloads)
Attachments D100.jpg (66KB - 245 downloads)
Attachments buttons.jpg (67KB - 239 downloads)
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d500neil
Posted 2009-05-29 6:39 PM (#175981 - in reply to #175971)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Location: bishop, ca		So, you're a member of KISS????






Edited by d500neil 2009-05-29 6:45 PM
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Doctor DeSoto
Posted 2009-05-30 3:37 AM (#176034 - in reply to #175924)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Parts Unknown
wizard - 2009-05-30 8:18 AM

I cannot help laughing about this topic ... it's sooo totally uncool to have a mismatched stickshift on a overkool pushbutton FL car. I can make one exception only - the 300 F with 4 speed, because the stickshift was nicely integrated in the consol. The FL cars where not supposed to be muscle institutes - you where supposed to play them like a tenor saxophone - with buttons and feeling.


***********************************

Well, it WAS the era of automatics for sure, and if you are going to have an automatic, what cooler way to shift it than pushbuttons ?

However, if you are of the mindset that likes more mechanical driving and that direct (not slushy) feel between your foot and the road, then an automatic just isn't going to cut it. I hate automatics. I think the pushbuttons are really cool and all, .... I just don't like automatics !

Further, .... I have always been drawn to the really way-out-there kinds of cars ... the more removed from a Chevy or Ford, the better. That is why I went DeSoto and not Chrysler. I like both, but one has the dinosaur appeal "edge" that draws funny looks. A DeSoto with a stick ? Now THAT is weird !

Just say "no" to ordinary.
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Ray Bell
Posted 2009-05-30 9:41 AM (#176057 - in reply to #176034)
Subject: Re: 1961 floor shift cars



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Location: Dalveen, Queensland, Australia		B/G 61... I believe I read somewhere yesterday you couldn't post a pic because it was too big?

I notice that many of the pics you post, and quite small ones at that, are .BMP files... bitmaps... if you make a practice of saving your files as .JPG files they will be smaller files and you'll be able to post larger images.

Now... Doc, I'm glad to see your attitude to having control over the gears in your car. Isn't it about time Kenny chimed in here and reminded us of his signature?

And is your 4-speed a Pont-a-Mousson, or a more modern unit like an A833?
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