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Location: CA | OK, so I did the first oil change on my recently acquired 57' Belvedere of which I'm super proud of and stoked about. It's quite awesome and at times surreal to be a part of this movement. Anyhow, after tightening everything back up under there, I noticed I had a spring about 1 inch of length on top of the drain pan. Upon noticing that, I couldn't remember for certain if that came out from within the filter cartridge system or not. Any information on this would be greatly appreciated. Thank You
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1128
 
Location: CA | Welcome to the forum! Maybe someone on here might have a scan of the oil filtration system breakdown. Sadly I don't. It might also be helpful to include which engine you have. 301 polysphere right? |
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Member
Posts: 34
Location: CA | Correct. 301 polyshphere it is. And thanks dude! I'm glad to finally be here lol. I will be visiting more frequently from here on out. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5140
Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | I'm pretty sure that goes over the center bolt in your cannister and before you put the element in it.. That spring pushes the filter against the engine .. thereby making the oil pass thru the filter instead of going around it..................MO |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5140
Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | How come you don't post your name and location?? The law after you????.......MO
Edited by MOPAR-TO-YA 2011-01-13 2:01 AM
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Member
Posts: 34
Location: CA | LOL no... I'm a law abiding citizen just like Gerard Butler lol.. But anyway thanks alot for the info. It makes total sense and it's all coming back to me now. Since I've owned my Plymouth it's been a hell of a joy ride and learning experience. They sure don't make cars like they used to... |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | Yes there should be a spring within the shell, which the bolt goes through before the cartridge goes in the shell. I was in there doing an oil change just last week. The photo of your spring does not look well though, the spring looks kind of munted...
Did you get the shell to seal against the seal in the block on the first attempt? These things are a bitch of a design!!! It doesn't help that the large seal supplied with the filter to fit in the block seems to be quite a bit too big these days and bunches up/out just where you can't see it....
Glenn.
Edited by FURY 2011-01-13 3:42 AM
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Member
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Location: CA | Awesome thanks for the info. I have about 4 years of hands on experience with lube, oil and filter servicing, but boy was I in for a surprise! At first I was getting so frustrated, and to top it off I had lost all the daylight that day before getting it back together. I had to borrow a friend's shop light and surprisingly with some descent light a bit of PATIENCE I got it on there. Of course now I have to get back under there and slap that spring back in. About getting the seal to perfectly after I was done, I'm not sure. There is a slight oil leak which I'm gunna take a look at when I take it apart again. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 5140
Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | Make SURE there is not an old gasket stuck up in the groove that the cannister fits into. It can be hard to see it and hard to dig it out. Poke an ice pick in it and be sure you are hitting metal cause an old gasket ( square O ring) can get very hard.........................MO |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | MOPAR-TO-YA - 2011-01-14 5:36 PM
Make SURE there is not an old gasket stuck up in the groove that the cannister fits into. It can be hard to see it and hard to dig it out. Poke an ice pick in it and be sure you are hitting metal cause an old gasket ( square O ring) can get very hard.........................MO
...no, there is definitely nothing up in there in the block...this is a hot tanked fully rebuilt motor, and of course the first thing I thought of was a trace of something stuck up in there but there wasn't. The gasket is too big-end of story. Is there a supplier for the correct gasket/seal that someone KNOWS of? Wix, Fram and Ryco oil filter gaskets/seals are ALL too big for the recess. |
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| You not be aware of it, but there is an oil filter adapter plate for the V8-277/301/318 that allows you to convert your cartridge type oil filter in a canister to the modern spin-on type filter. Very easy to install. |
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Inactive by user's request
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada | rbmain - 2011-01-16 12:50 AM
You not be aware of it, but there is an oil filter adapter plate for the V8-277/301/318 that allows you to convert your cartridge type oil filter in a canister to the modern spin-on type filter. Very easy to install.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1128
Location: CA | Hey that's cool, I didn't know that. Where are those spin-on adapters sold? |
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Inactive by user's request
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada | Finsinthemirror - 2011-01-16 1:29 PM
Hey that's cool, I didn't know that. Where are those spin-on adapters sold?
Mine came from a '64 or '65 318 at Big M's. I also had my block modified by the machinist for full flow through the oil filter.
K. |
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Inactive by user's request
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada | Finsinthemirror - 2011-01-12 6:37 PM
Welcome to the forum! Maybe someone on here might have a scan of the oil filtration system breakdown. Sadly I don't. It might also be helpful to include which engine you have. 301 polysphere right?
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Member
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Location: CA | rbmain - 2011-01-16 12:50 AM
You not be aware of it, but there is an oil filter adapter plate for the V8-277/301/318 that allows you to convert your cartridge type oil filter in a canister to the modern spin-on type filter. Very easy to install.
Wow, that's awesome. Thanks for the info. This conversion sounds like something I would definitely consider in the future. I bet it saves you big time "HEADACHES"... |
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Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed
Posts: 1295
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | I sell them on Ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=35043...
I can sell them directly also. They are $24.00 which includes shipping first class mail. You can also order them at your Mopar dealer but they run about $50 there. Email me directly at:
george@mckovich.com
Thanks
George
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
 
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK |
So are these a Direct Bolt on and then use a Spin On Filter, Or do i need to Plug or Drill something for extra Oil Flow,, I am sure i read something some time back about Plugging or Blocking something Off,,
The Engine in Question would be a 59 Dodge 326ci..
Clive |
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Member
Posts: 34
Location: CA |
Awesome! thanks a bunch. I will be ordering my kit around mon-tues. I haven't even ordered it yet and I can already sigh at the fact of such relief that it will bring me when doing an oil change!  |
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Inactive by user's request
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada |
Great news! The sad part is, even with one of these, changing the filter on my '57's 354 will still be a bit of a mess, since the filter mounts "upside down" due to clearance issues. 
K.
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Board Moderator
Posts: 3186
Location: The not-so-great, dirty-white North ( Michigan) | Kenny...
Would a vertical mounted filter adapter (places the filter vertically on the engine) have clearance enough to clear the torsion bar?
Hard to tell the depth separation in that picture.
Also, which is better for the 330, a vertical mount spin-on, or a spin-on at that same 30 degree up-angle?
Looks like a horizontal might have exhaust pipe issues...... |
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Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed
Posts: 1295
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | No plugging required. Just bolt on and then screw the new cartridge on. |
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Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed
Posts: 1295
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | They aren't for the 354. They fit 301, 303, 313 and 318 POLY's. |
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Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed
Posts: 1295
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | It saves the headache of either not tightening enough and having it leak at the top against the block or tightening too much and cracking the gasket on the screw in shaft.... one or the other always seems to happen to me. I have one on my 56 Fury 303 and I also put one on the 58 Fargo 313 that we restored.
George
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Inactive by user's request
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada | chrysler300c - 2011-01-23 11:35 AM
They aren't for the 354. They fit 301, 303, 313 and 318 POLY's.
I see that now. I saw a spin-on adapter for the 354 at Hot Heads, though.
K. |
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK | chrysler300c - 2011-01-23 7:33 PM
No plugging required. Just bolt on and then screw the new cartridge on.
Bought and Paid mate,, Mine will be the England UK .. So what Oil Filter will i need for the 326ci as i see you list 2 Types..
Thanks Clive |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | George.
Where are these made?
Have you experimented with a way of using this system, and modifying the original shell to attach over the top so that it still looks original?
Do you have a source for the spin-on filters as well? Make and part number? Are they available in WIX Made in USA?
Glenn.
Edited by FURY 2011-01-23 3:42 PM
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Walter passed away on Jul 29, 2014. We will miss you, Walt!
Posts: 5358
Location: Heaven Above (Formerly Oklahoma City,OK) | Try the Fram PH2 or equivalent spin on filter. |
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Board Moderator
Posts: 3186
Location: The not-so-great, dirty-white North ( Michigan) | Kenny J. - 2011-01-23 2:52 PM
chrysler300c - 2011-01-23 11:35 AM
They aren't for the 354. They fit 301, 303, 313 and 318 POLY's.
I see that now. I saw a spin-on adapter for the 354 at Hot Heads, though.
K.
Kenny...
That is what I am referring to.
Hot Heads, QEC, REV Engineering and a few others make 3 different styles.
The first places a screw-on filter at the same position as the canister filter (30 degree up angle).
The second places the filter horizontally out from the block
The third places the filter up and down (vertical) like the Small-Block Chevy filter.
So application depends on clearance...... |
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Member
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Location: CA | chrysler300c - 2011-01-23 11:38 AM
It saves the headache of either not tightening enough and having it leak at the top against the block or tightening too much and cracking the gasket on the screw in shaft.... one or the other always seems to happen to me. I have one on my 56 Fury 303 and I also put one on the 58 Fargo 313 that we restored.
George
I see. Yeah I guess those are the kind of bitter-sweet moments that come along with these awesome and sexy rides... |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1128
Location: CA | Anybody have a spare filter spring for the poly they'd part with? |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Maybe the Dodge's filters are very different from the Plymouth's, but the 55-58 Dodge Poly/Hemi engines have canister
filter housings that look just like Kenny's engine photo, above.
I've been changing Horace's oil filters since 1981 with NO problems or head aches, or even gratuitous cussing....being involved.
The flat rubber filter gaskets conform perfectly to the base unit, and truth-be-told, many times I just re-use the 'old' gasket
because it has taken a natural set to the base unit and it is in perfect condition.
The ONLY problem (and, it is not really a 'problem') with the canister, is that with a 1957 Hemi (dunno about 55-56 guys)
the size of the valve cover means that there is not physical room, between it and the inner-panel, to remove the canister,
so, I just lay it over on its side, lying against the inner panel's shelf, while I remove and replace the oil filter element.
The filter elements are an in-stock item at every (good) parts house, because other olde cars use that same filter, too.
One tool that everyone should have, though, is a short open face wrench which can be used to loosen/tighten the canister-
nut, without rounding off the mating-edges of it.
There are a lot of other good important things to spend your money on, rather than on a spin-on oil filter, from my 30-year's
experience changing my car's engine oil, a couple times per year.
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | And, oh-yeah: no filter "springs" are (or have-been) required, at least from my 30+ years' experience with oil changing.
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| If you're a know-it-all with 30+ years of experience knowing it all, please ignore the attached document and get angry with me for challenging. For Finsinthemirror and "take me back" the spring goes between the inside of the canister and a washer that sits on the bolt shaft on top of the filter. You could find a general purpose spring and washer to do the same thing. These cartridge filters have been obsolete for 10+ years, and impossible to find anymore. The PH8 and PZ1 spin-on filters are a lot less messy and much easier to buy at the local parts store. Richard
Edited by rbmain 2011-02-03 9:32 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | Richard.
All your observations are 100% accurate, except the cartridge is still freely available. The correct Wix filter is # 51080, and that filter is still made in USA, In Gastonia, NC.
One to AVOID AT ALL COSTS is the Purolator filter cartridge which is made in India and looks like a 7 year old's school project...
I don't know what engine Neil has in his Dodge but maybe he is referring to a different system to that which the factory Poly engine runs, which DOES have a spring as you have illustrated, and it IS a pain in the ass to get sealed sometimes...
Glenn.
Edited by FURY 2011-02-03 9:39 PM
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| Cool, do the WIX come with all the gaskets, seals, and washers like the Fram does? |
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | Well yes they do but as I said earlier I seem to be having trouble with the big gasket that goes in the block being a little larger than what it wants to be, which is causing it to not seal in the first couple of attempts. It is fine now but it would be a lot easier if this big gasket was a tad smaller in O/D. I wonder if I could reach someone at Wix to mention it to them?
Glenn. |
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Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed
Posts: 1295
Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | I have no idea and don't care where they are made.... they work and that is what matters to me. They are made by Fram. No experiments with trying to disguise it.
George
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Richard; no problem, man.
I'm just saying that for as long as I've owned my car and serviced it, since 1981, there's never been a spring which holds down
the oil filter inside the canister, and my car's oil pressure has always remained rock steady, as seen in that newest pic
of the dash panel, over on the what-did-you-do-to-your-car-today thread, and there's never been any lack of lubrication
or contamination issues.
Changing the oil 1-2 times/year probably doesn't hurt the oil contamination problem, either.
I've also never had any issues with the fitting of the flat rubber mating gasket, to the base unit, either.
Just lay the gasket down (when a new one is installed I pre-lube it) into the 'shoulders' of the base unit and twist down the canister until
it gets snug, and then use the wrench to tighten the canister to the base.
The spring was almost certainly designed for millions' of drivers' possible mis-use of the cars, in a myriad of situations.
You got it; you want to use: fine; it, just, is not necessary for the normal operation of our cars.
Edited by d500neil 2011-02-05 2:03 PM
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Board Moderator
Posts: 3186
Location: The not-so-great, dirty-white North ( Michigan) | Neil...
I don't think the lack of a spring will affect your oil pressure.
However, the filter canister is most likely "floating" inside the canister cartridge shell, leading you to have WAY more "shunt" bypass of unfiltered oil than with the spring in place (if that is true).
You might look at your cartridge next time you pull it. The spring is above a washer at the "top" of the cartridge, and that washer is kept in place by y the bolt being upset to form a pair of "ears" to retain both.
If you cannot easily pull the bolt out of the cartridge, than I bet you have a spring and washer.
If you were to convert Horrie to a spin-on, you also need to remove the #5 main bearing cap and pull out the bypass valve above the oil pump in the block oil passage leading up and over to the filter pad and replace it with a Hot Heads item which blocks the bypass. This makes your system a full-flow system like modern oil systems. The shunt system that the Dodge hemis used was to prevent cold oil pressure from blowing the canister seal and puking oil over the ground. But unfiltered oil is unfiltered oil!
The modern spin-on filters have a bypass valve built-in so you don't need the one in the engine block, which leaked all the time. Just sometimes more than other times...... |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Hmmmmm, Hank; maybe "I" do have that spring/washer, because I've never had that through-bolt slide out from the canister!
I've cleaned the interior of the canister, at times, but sure don't recall ever noticing anything at the upper end of the canister
(which would be keeping the bolt from slipping out of/from the canister; i.e.: the spring/washer guys).
So, maybe they ARE there, and until this thread, I never had to give the through bolt any thought...there must be some sort of
gasket (shown, above) which keeps the oil from escaping via the bolt's access hole.
Wow; as I said, the oil filter-canister protocol has never given me any problems, in 30 years' of oil changing.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | Here is a nos oil filter shell on Ebay, complete with that spring that doesn't exist....
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1955-56-57-58-59-Plymouth-Dodge-NOS-...
Glenn. |
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Expert
Posts: 1532
Location: ZH, Switzerland | By the way: a 1956 Chrysler 354 Hemi also has a canister style oil filter case. Please could anybody with the same engine tell me what type of cartridge filter fits best? Thanks.
For my 1962 318 Poly engine I bought an adapter to replace the canister style filter with a spin on filter from Gary Pavlovich (the Poly expert).
Happy motoring!
Dieter |
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Extreme Veteran
Posts: 520
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado | I used to get the filter for my 392's at napa, was a napa gold filter IIRC. Its been 10 years though, so i dunno about availability now. |
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Location: Parts Unknown | Just a quick tip for those who might have binding problems with that gasket ...
... dip your finger in the freshly drained oil and get the new gasket (should you decide to
use the new gasket - Neil is right, you can reuse these for some time) nice and oiled up
and then place it into the groove. It will go in with reasonable ease, and when the canister
comes into contact with it as it is screwed tight, it will freely slide against the rubber without
any binding or bunching to get a nice seal.
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1068
Location: Auckland, New Zealand. | With all due respect, that is fairly obvious to anybody who has ever changed their own oil, and I have been doing that. The problem is that the rubber seal is too big for the recess in the block.
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Member
Posts: 8
Location: Longpont sur Orge, France | Hi All,
I'm a French 1964 Plymouth Fury 318 poly owner and I'm looking for a oil filter adapter to use modern oil filter.
I tried to reach by email Mr chrysler300c but as this post is very old, maybe it's a wrong address.
Do you know where can I buy this adapter for 318 poly?
I owned this car for 4 years and we use it as daily car.
Thank you for your help
Fabrice |
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Exner Expert 10K+
Posts: 10290
Location: Lower Mainland BC | g80panthera - 2019-12-11 12:45 PM
Do you know where can I buy this adapter for 318 poly? Fabrice
I am very surprised that a 65 Plymouth did not have a spin on filter. My family had a 65 Plymouth Fury III with the wide body 318 and I am pretty sure it had a spin on.
In any event, try Hot Hemi Heads. They make adapters for older hemis and might have one that works on a 318 poly:
http://www.hothemiheads.com/dodge/index.html
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Expert
Posts: 1755
Location: Alaska | The 318 Plymouth is very easy to convert. You just need the the adapter plate and center screw in fitting from an A or LA small block that has the proper fitting. There was even a 90 degree angle adapter made for it from the factory, IIRC for the 273 in the A body cars. Forgot to mention, these are factory parts not aftermarket.
Edited by 58coupe 2019-03-11 9:21 PM
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Member
Posts: 8
Location: Longpont sur Orge, France | Hi,
@56D500boy: it"s 64 Fury not 65 Fury. And I'm sure for not spin on filter due to the diificulties at every filter change with oil leak. I 'll try the hothemiheads site.
@58coupe: yes I agree: a plate, a screw and gaskets. I think there is a plate out diameter difference between A and LA engine. Maybe the center screw is the same?
Thank you |
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1957 Plymouth Belvedere Oil Filter/Cartridge Question?
