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Veteran
Posts: 174
 
Location: Hebron, IN | OK so my car shudders when in Drive and stopped. Looks like I have an idle issue, and I know when cold it is hard starting. In looking at it lit would appear as if my choke is not connected. Here are a couple pics:
OK so I think my carb is the problem. If I two foot it I get no shudder. That is the good news. Bad news is it looks like there are some things missing from my carb. I snapped a couple pics but my phone doesn't want to upload them right now. It looks like the choke is not hooked up to anything and isn't there supposed to be a kickdown cable somewhere (I may be wrong, not too familiar with these old Mopars). I will work on getting the pics, but I'm not sure the carb is factory- it has a red and black label on it that says CARTER AFB | Competition Series 
Throttle linkage:
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Expert
Posts: 1373
Location: central Illinois | It's definitely NOT a factory carb. Looking at the last picture, the choke is not hooked up. For some reason I thought the competition series cars didn't even have a choke plate, but yours does. The small lever in the top plate, in the middle of the carb is for the choke. You can hook up a manual cable to that, or use the bosses at the front of the carb and add an electric choke there. There should be a mounting bracket for a cable, just under the fuel inlet.
The factory heat riser rod is bent over so as not to interfere with the choke and is not operable in this condition, just as well.
Curious what the casting number is on the intake manifold? |
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | I will look on the manifold for a casting number (I haven't owned the car for a week yet).
I do have paperwork for the engine rebuild (done 10 years ago but then the car was torn down for paint that never happened) - I do know it was punched .030 over, has some KB flat top pistons and the heads were reworked with hardened valve seats and 3 angle machining.
I will have to look at the carb and see if I can get a model number- I would rather put an electic choke on it than run a cable into the cab. Problem is I haven't owned a carbed vehicle since the 80s when I was a kid so I don't know much about them... I am willing to learn and at least this time around I don't NEED the car to get to work, LOL.
This winter I will probably be pulling the intake off and cleaning/painting the engine. Right now my plans are paint (car is currently in primer) and fix all the mechanical issues and cruise for the summer. This winter I will do an engine detail and interior rebuild- seats and door panels are already done but it needs carpet and headliner.
Edited by Destr0 2012-05-22 10:42 PM
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | Can anyone help identify the above carb? I have looked on it for numbers and have not found any... I did get the casting numbers off the intake, but of course I forgot the paper I wrote them on in the car. I want to order a rebuild kit and am not sure which one will fit it. I have to order some other stuff from Amazon.com and was wondering if anyone can tell me if this kit will work on the above carb:
http://www.amazon.com/JEGS-Performance-Products-150300-Rebuild/dp/B...
I am also going to add a manual choke cable. I would like to go electric but right now to get it running right I am going to keep it simple (and cheap- all these parts add up fast). |
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Expert
Posts: 2325
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | It looks right but match up the gaskets to the old ones of course, there should be a number under the label, also are the primary and secondary throttles the same size. |
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Expert
Posts: 1373
Location: central Illinois | It looks like you'll have to rebuild your accelerator pump? I've never seen a kit like this but maybe that's how they're doing them now.
Most regular AFB's have the number on the right front area of the lower plate. Should be a 4 digit number. You might have to move the red painted coil to see it. |
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Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | I have never rebuilt a carb before but my friend who has rebuilt several will be helping me. I am going to go out and check the carb again for a number before I order the parts. |
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | OK I got the carb number- sure enough it was hiding behind the red coil. I was able to use the camera on my phone to "see" behind the coil.
The numbers off the carb are: 9605S 3335
And the casting number on the intake is: 1851898 looks like 383 4 bl intake from 59, but I do nt see a casting number for 413 single 4bl only dual 4bl intakes...
Edited by Destr0 2012-06-04 9:36 PM
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Expert
Posts: 1373
Location: central Illinois | Sounds like the original intake. If they ask for a carb number, 9605S is it. You should order an accelerator pump too. This one I'm posting is just for a reference picture of what it looks like http://www.jegs.com/i/Edelbrock/350/1467/10002/-1 You'll have to get with them and make sure it's right for your carb. Seems like most problems with Carter/Edelbrock carbs are directly associated with the accelerator pump. Pay attention to making sure the seal "swells" according to the instructions. Good luck!
I just noticed you're from Hebron. Gonna have that NYer at the Mopar Nationals? Oh wait, that's in Ohio, lol.
Edited by b5rt 2012-06-04 9:46 PM
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | Ohio isn't too far away - I think we are going to Mopar Nationals but not in the NYer (this year). I hope to have it ready for paint in the next couple weeks and have it painted and all the trim (at least all that is usable, LOL) back on by the end of July.
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | Carb kit came today - I did not see your note about the accelorator pump until after I had placed the order with JEGS so I do not have one of those... I wonder if I can get one at a local parts store if I need it when I rebuild the carb tomorrow. Is the 600 CFM carb big enough for my 418 motor (413 + .030 = 418 from what I gather). Should I just get an Edelbrock Performer in 750 CFM? I suppose I will if I can't get this one to work right. :-) She is a big old cruiser and not a hot rod, and has plenty of get up N go already, just have some idle issues.
I only ask because one of the local gearheads at work was saying with a 413 you need at least 750CFM and he would probably go 900+
He is into hot rods and has a 51 Ford that he drag races...
Edited by Destr0 2012-06-06 3:00 PM
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Expert
Posts: 1484
Location: NorCal | Destr0 - 2012-06-06 11:57 AM
I only ask because one of the local gearheads at work was saying with a 413 you need at least 750CFM and he would probably go 900+
The original 413 AFB was in the 550 cfm range, unless you have some potent mods a 625 cfm is all you need.
One problem I see with the original carb pictured above is the missing choke...it not only makes cold starts hard but there is a wide open vacuum leak where the choke housing mated to the main body; when the choke housing is removed the vacuum hole needs to be plugged. |
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | The motor in question has some mild mods- new lifters/valves/roller rockers as well as .030 over with some KB Hyper pistons (only 9.0 to 1 or so the paperwork claims), nothing too drastic. Seems to have plenty of power under throttle, my issues with the carb are all idle related as far as I can tell. The choke is there, it is a manual choke that isn't connected to a cable (cable on order, just not here yet). There is an electric choke for an Edelbrock carb that isn't to hard to make fit this carb from what I gather but right now the $10 price of the cable and simplicity was better than another "project" that was $52.
I guess if I ever want to upgrade the carb I should probably do a better exhaust first. Stock one is dual but has lots of bends and skinny pipe. :-)
Edited by Destr0 2012-06-06 4:28 PM
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Expert
Posts: 2325
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | Without worrying about racing 600 cfm will work ok. |
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | We got the carb off, cleaned all parts and re-assembled using the rebuild kit- carb is still not functioning right. We did not have a timing light so that will have to wait until tomorrow and hope that poor timing is our issue- to get the car to not shudder when not moving in drive the idle has to be set so high the car lurches when the gears are selected. Going to try with to get the timing tomorrow and perhaps new plugs and wires. I know nothing of carbs but the mixture screws on this one don't seem to affect much. :-(
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Expert
Posts: 2325
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | That means the the idle is too high, or you have a vacuum leak.
Edited by Shep 2012-06-08 8:19 AM
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | I believe you are correct in that we have the idle too high- it is probably set to 1000 RPM or so currently- any lower and it runs very rough. Again I believe it is a timing issue that needs to be addressed before we can propperly tune the carb. I have a timing light and tach today so hopefully we will make better progress. Thanks again for your help, I will report back with our results.
It IS better than it was- but still not right by any means. |
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Veteran
Posts: 174
Location: Hebron, IN | OK got the timing set during lunch- runs a lot better now, no more missing or high idle. Still need to fine tune the mixture but ran out of time. I do have it at a 600 RPM idle and running smooth now, but when I put it in gear is stalls out and dies so I think I need to bump it up just a touch.
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Carter Carb on 59 NYer-
