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Member
Posts: 8
| I have a 1954 Windsor with a 6 cylinder engine and PowerFlite that has been in storage for 40 years. The engine runs great, but when shifting from N to either D or R, there is no slippage. If the engine doesn't stall, the rear wheels start turning immediately. Just like dumping the clutch on a standard transmission. Any suggestions? |
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Expert
Posts: 3393
   
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | Not sure what the issue is, up on a jack,? why would you look for slippage? Does it stall immediately when drive is engaged, or have no power brake stall speed?
Edited by Shep 2016-08-14 5:59 PM
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Posts: 13045
Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island | To me, this sounds like the torque converter is full of gunk (old transmission fluid that has hardened of age and standing still for years).
You need to drain all the fluid, pull the transmission pan and drain the converter for a start. The quality of the transmission fluid will tell you a lot.... |
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Expert
Posts: 3775
Location: NorCal |
Welcome to the board E028589.
By "no slippage" I assume you mean no stall speed. If the brakes aren't applied when shifting from Neutral to a gear, the wheels will start to turn immediately. If the brakes are applied and the engine stalls when placed in a gear, either the engine tuneup is poor or the torque converter stator is freewheeling.
If you brake with your left foot and keep the engine running with your right foot can you raise the engine rpm above an idle? |
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Member
Posts: 8
| Yes, the car is now on jack stands to keep the rear wheels off the floor. Right now, if the brakes are on, and the car is placed in gear, and the engine is at or near idle, it stalls because the brakes prevent the rear wheels from turning. If the engine is above idle, the brakes are not applied, and it doesn't stall when the lever is moved from N to D, the bias ply tires squeal and the car moves forward. Just like with a manual transmission. This car does not have power brakes.
Slippage normally occurs when an automatic is in D or R with the engine at idle, like waiting at a stop light. There might be a tendency for the car to move slightly when you release the brake, but not much. |
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Member
Posts: 8
| Not a bad suggestion; thanks! Reading about this design, it appears the engine oil is what circulates in the torque converter. The Dextron Type 1 or 2 fluid only circulates in the transmission itself. We've changed the engine oil several times, but should probably change it again and also look to see whether there's more gunk, or the converter is getting warm as the engine warms up. We'll check that out. Thanks! |
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Member
Posts: 8
| Thanks for the welcome! It's great to be here!
Not sure what you mean when you say "no stall speed". The engine starts easily, warms up and idles smoothly. Right now the car is on jack stands, and as throttle is applied, the engine runs smoothly, and the transmission shifts into second gear. Not sure if it is shifting at the right speed as there is no load on the rear wheels, though. What is happening if the torque converter is "freewheeling"? Right now, it appears that 100% of the engine power (torque) is being transferred through the torque converter and transmission to the driveshaft when it's in gear. Just like a clutch and standard transmission arrangement.
If I brake with my left foot (the rear wheels are on jack stands; off the ground), as long as the brakes can overpower the rear wheels turning, the engine chugs to a stop. Just like a standard transmission. |
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Expert
Posts: 3393
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | Sounds like the convertor is bad, the stator is locked up, it acts like a standard clutch as you say,. |
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Expert
Posts: 3775
Location: NorCal | E028589 - 2016-08-15 5:42 PM
If I brake with my left foot (the rear wheels are on jack stands; off the ground), as long as the brakes can overpower the rear wheels turning, the engine chugs to a stop. Just like a standard transmission.
If you brake with your left and try to keep the engine running with the throttle does it still chug to a stop? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 8443
Location: Perth Australia | Engine oil does NOT go in the torque converter, it uses trans fluid.
As said above, your torque converter sounds like its no good, it might come back, but I doubt it
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Member
Posts: 8
| I've not tried with the engine throttle really hard against the brakes, but yes I've tried keeping the engine going while applying the brakes. Engine still stalls when the wheels stop turning. :-( |
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Member
Posts: 8
| I had read an article concerning the engine oil running through the converter. It wasn't a Chrysler document, so I'm sure you're right about the transmition fluid going through the converter. I mis-spoke.
Anyway, another thought I had concerning the torque converter was that it might loosen up if the car were driven around a bit. |
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+
Posts: 13045
Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island | The PowerFlites and TorqueFlites can be run on Engine oil, but that's the complete transmission, not only the torque converter.
I would'nt recommend this though - the Dextron III works very nice 
Also, there was yellowish transmission fluid that can be mistaken for engine oil 
In one of its strangest applications, the Los Angeles Police equipped its 1960 Plymouth Savoy fleet (330 units) with a 318 cubic inch V-8 and the Powerflite transmission (along with 303 similar Dodge Darts). The vastly superior Torqueflite had been around for three full years, and was king of the fleet buyer’s specifications — but the LAPD specified that the transmission had to share the oil with the engine!
It was an odd demand, and only Chrysler was able to meet the specification, virtually without any changes to the transmission. Both Chevrolet’s Powerglide and Ford’s 2 speed Fordamatic destroyed themselves within a few hundred miles with 20 weight engine grade oil. The Powerflite and later Torqueflite soldiered on like nothing happened.
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Member
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| Wizard, that was the article. Thanks! |
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Veteran
Posts: 291
Location: Colorful Colorado skier on the license plate | Does your Winsor have a clutch pedal? there were some M-6 transmissions still in 1954. and they used the engine's oil in the torque convertor. |
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Member
Posts: 8
| No, there is no clutch pedal. Sorry, but I think I might have confused the discussion concerning engine oil. Please disregard that comment.
This transmission is a 2-speed automatic and uses Type A, so we're using Dextron Type 2. |
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PowerFlite doesn't slip from N into D or R
