The Forward Look Network
The Forward Look Network
Search | Statistics | User Listing Forums | Chat | eBay | Calendars | Albums | Skins | Language
You are logged in as a guest. ( logon | register )

Constipated horn
Jump to page : 1
Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page]
View previous thread :: View next thread
   Forward Look Technical Discussions -> Electrical, Battery and ChargingMessage format
 
56D500boy
Posted 2018-05-24 9:03 PM (#563991)
Subject: Constipated horn



Expert

Posts: 3546
2000100050025
Location: Lower Mainland BC
As part of my cold air induction scoop project, I had to swap the horns from left to right to gain clearance to the air scoop. I had not hooked the right horn (used to be the left one) up until the other day. I tried the horn (key set to "RUN") and there was a toot from at least one of them, but not necessarily both of them. Today, I disconnected both horns and ran a jumper wire from the (+) battery terminal to the horn terminals (just touching the horn terminals lightly). The right one seemed to work fine. "TOOT!!" The left one made a slight noise ("THUK") like a metal diaphragm getting sucked to something like a magnet. But no vibrating "horn" noise. I don't think the left/right swap has anything to do with it (but it might). I can't honestly tell you that both horns were working before I swapped them.

Not sure what the next step is (??)



Before I hooked up the right horn:



Edited by 56D500boy 2018-05-24 9:16 PM




(56DodgeWithHornsSwappedRightToLeftLeftToRightToClearNewColdAirScoop.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments 56DodgeWithHornsSwappedRightToLeftLeftToRightToClearNewColdAirScoop.jpg (142KB - 17 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2018-05-24 10:04 PM (#563994 - in reply to #563991)
Subject: Re: Constipated horn



Expert

Posts: 4659
200020005001002525
Location: So. California
It appears you have a Los Angeles built car with the Jubilee horns. First, check the ground to the driver. Attach a dedicated ground connection to test it out. If it works then you know what the problem is. If not (which is most likely) then your driver is going bad from corrosion inside it. There may be a way to fix it, but I haven't attempted it. Maybe a higher voltage would knock it loose??? You can often find new horns for these by getting them on Ebay. With the new horn, swap out the driver to your old horn so you keep all the 56 Dodge specific parts with it. That is the approach I have been taking with mine.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2018-05-24 11:26 PM (#563999 - in reply to #563994)
Subject: Re: Constipated horn



Expert

Posts: 3546
2000100050025
Location: Lower Mainland BC
Powerflite - 2018-05-24 10:04 PM

It appears you have a Los Angeles built car with the Jubilee horns. First, check the ground to the driver. Attach a dedicated ground connection to test it out. If it works then you know what the problem is. If not (which is most likely) then your driver is going bad from corrosion inside it. There may be a way to fix it, but I haven't attempted it.


Thanks Nathan. It is an LA-built 56 Dodge. I found this video on fixing an electro-mechanical horn. Seems easy enough:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LG8ivFOjIps

It looks like the big lock nut on my horn and the set screw/adjustment might be the adjustment suggested in the video.

Also looks like taking the horn apart would involve drilling out a bunch of rivets. No biggy. I have drill and lots of pop-rivets solve that problem.




Edited by 56D500boy 2018-05-25 12:57 AM
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2018-05-24 11:46 PM (#564000 - in reply to #563991)
Subject: Re: Constipated horn



Expert

Posts: 4659
200020005001002525
Location: So. California
I've tried to fix them in the past, and got them working a little better, but never very well.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2018-05-27 1:50 AM (#564060 - in reply to #563999)
Subject: Re: Constipated horn



Expert

Posts: 3546
2000100050025
Location: Lower Mainland BC
56D500boy - 2018-05-24 11:26 PM
It looks like the big lock nut on my horn and the set screw/adjustment might be the adjustment suggested in the video.
Also looks like taking the horn apart would involve drilling out a bunch of rivets. No biggy. I have drill and lots of pop-rivets solve that problem.


Maybe.

I tried the big adjustment screw (after using a crescent wrench on the big lock nut) to see if that helped. Nope.

So I removed the horn from the car and disassembled it.

Two bolts and four rivets. Rivets seem to be 3/16" (at least that is what I used to drill off the crimped end of the rivet).

There are three main parts:

1. The top with the electrics
2. The diaphragm and piston
3. The base and trumpet

The diaphragm is sandwiched between two paper gaskets, one between the diaphragm and the top and one between the diaphragm and the base.

With the top off, I could see that there are dual points. There is a coil driver powered by the 12V connection on the top. There is a very thin resistance wire (like a heater??). There is also a small adjustment screw that pushes on the plate that the points are on. This is the one that I probably could have adjusted to make the horn work. But I didn't know until the horn was apart.

As I understand the function of the horn from the Youtube link I watched above (previous post), when the power to the horn comes through from the horn relay, the coil is energized which pulls (pushes??) the diaphragm piston and its outer ring which in turn causes the connection for the points to be lost. Then the piston goes back to rest position and points make contact again which starts the cycle again. So there is a buzz which is amplified by the "trumpet" and the sound is manifested as a "BEEEP!" (or maybe "BAAAP" seeing as this one is the "LOW" "Jubilee" horn. (NOTE: "Here's something you might not know: the word jubilee comes from the Hebrew word yobel, which means “ram's horn trumpet.”)

So far, in addition to dissembling the horn, I have cleaned the dual points, wire brushed the exterior and put everything but the top into a bath of EvapoRust. Tomorrow I will clean everything up at bit more with a brass wire brush and prep it for paint. I will also Ohm out the internal wires to make sure that the connections are good. I will then make two gaskets (probably from an old file folder - seems to be the right thickness) by tracing the outside, marking the location of the holes, cutting the gaskets out (probably using scissors for the outside and an X-acto knife for the inside),with holes punched with a single hole punch. Then I will reassemble temporarily with spring clamps and try the horn with jumper wires off the battery. Probably try the two adjustment screws. IF it works I will assemble with four 3/16" pop rivets and the two bolts. Then I will try the horn again, adjusting screws as needed before giving the exterior a final sand and a wipe followed by a couple of coats of Tremclad semi-gloss black, masking off the electrical connection and ground bracket areas to ensure good current flow.

When it dries, back into the car and on to the next can of worms - OR - even better - the final front carpet adjustment(s) and installation of the front seat.

I am too easily distracted by issues that aren't serious.





Edited by 56D500boy 2018-05-27 12:08 PM




(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_BeforeDisassembly.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopOff.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_DiaphragmOff.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_BottomAndTopSeparated.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_LoJubStamping.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopShowingConnectionsAndAdjustments.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopShowingConnectionsAndAdjustments_UnderSide.jpg)



(56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopShowingConnectionsAndAdjustments_UnderSide_Details.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_BeforeDisassembly.jpg (134KB - 16 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopOff.jpg (136KB - 17 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_DiaphragmOff.jpg (151KB - 18 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_BottomAndTopSeparated.jpg (143KB - 16 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_LoJubStamping.jpg (113KB - 17 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopShowingConnectionsAndAdjustments.jpg (159KB - 16 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopShowingConnectionsAndAdjustments_UnderSide.jpg (165KB - 16 downloads)
Attachments 56DodgeLABuildLowJubileeHorn_TopShowingConnectionsAndAdjustments_UnderSide_Details.jpg (195KB - 16 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Greg P.
Posted 2018-07-06 5:06 PM (#566149 - in reply to #563991)
Subject: RE: Constipated horn



Elite Veteran

Posts: 769
5001001002525
Location: Oley, PA
How'd it end up?
Top of the page Bottom of the page
ttotired
Posted 2018-07-06 7:42 PM (#566163 - in reply to #563991)
Subject: Re: Constipated horn



Expert 5K+

Posts: 8259
5000200010001001002525
Location: Perth Australia
Just for those that don't know, the "strange thin resistance wire" is important, it does the same job as the condenser in a distributor

Without it, the contacts will burn up

Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2018-07-07 11:33 AM (#566214 - in reply to #566163)
Subject: Re: Constipated horn



Expert

Posts: 3546
2000100050025
Location: Lower Mainland BC
Greg P. - 2018-07-06 5:06 PM
How'd it end up?


I was away for 3 weeks and am just getting back to all the little projects that I left undone before I went on holiday.

ttotired - 2018-07-06 7:42 PM
Just for those that don't know, the "strange thin resistance wire" is important, it does the same job as the condenser in a distributor.
Without it, the contacts will burn up


Thanks. I did not know that. I hope that I didn't mess that wire up then.

Top of the page Bottom of the page
Jump to page : 1
Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page]
Jump to forum :
Search this forum
Printer friendly version
E-mail a link to this thread



(Delete all cookies set by this site)