The Forward Look Network
The Forward Look Network
Search | Statistics | User Listing Forums | Chat | eBay | Calendars | Albums | Skins | Language
You are logged in as a guest. ( logon | register )

adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?
Jump to page : 1
Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page]
View previous thread :: View next thread
   Forward Look Technical Discussions -> Engine, Exhaust, Fuel and IgnitionMessage format
 
di_ch_NY56
Posted 2019-04-15 1:47 PM (#580923)
Subject: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert

Posts: 1230
100010010025
Location: ZH, Switzerland

Today I just got a phone call from my engine builder about the crankshaft. A crankshaft with the old style end would cost between USD 5000.- and 10'000.- not balanced. I want to stick with the A466 in my Letter and so in my head the question (Subject) rose. it's because a rotating asseembly (crankshaft, connection rods, pistons /w rings fully balanced) for a 440 costs about USD 2500.- to 3000.-

Of course there are two other options...

a) metal hot spray to all bearing surfaces to shave the bearing surfaces afterward to the factory specification.

b) new style crankshaft and a A727, but that's what I do not want in my Letter.

I'll appreciate your answers. Thank you.

Happy Restoring!

Dieter

Top of the page Bottom of the page
wizard
Posted 2019-04-15 3:06 PM (#580929 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: Re: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+

Posts: 11884
500050001000500100100100252525
Location: Southern Sweden - Sturkö island
The only economical and good option is to buy a fair used crankshaft and grind it to under dimension
Top of the page Bottom of the page
57chizler
Posted 2019-04-16 2:36 PM (#580978 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: RE: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert

Posts: 3138
2000100010025
Location: NorCal
Is hard-chroming the journals an option? Used to be the cheapest way in The States.

https://www.powercrankshaft.com/crankshaft-repair/
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2019-04-16 3:24 PM (#580984 - in reply to #580978)
Subject: RE: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5266
50001001002525
Location: So. California
I have been told many times by experienced people not to do hard chrome plating. It eventually wears off and creates debri in your bearings. Not good.

Welding up the crank journal and grinding it back to spec is fine though. I have done that many times without any issue. That's what I would do if I were in your shoes. In the US, I could get that done for about $150 + $150 for the rest of the machining. Not too expensive.

If you do go with a new style crank, I would use the '62-'65 push button 727 trans that will mate up well with your push buttons, but does require a number of different modifications to your driveshaft, trans mount etc.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2019-04-16 3:29 PM (#580985 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: Re: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5266
50001001002525
Location: So. California
But....it sounds like you don't have a journal that has been ruined. It sounds like you just want to bring the whole crank up to spec. If that's the case, then just grind the whole thing to .01" under and use oversize bearings. Oversize bearings are usually cheaper than standard because that's what everyone does. If you want to retain the hard nitride on the surface of the journals, then the hot metal spray *might* be a good option. It depends on how well it remains stuck to the surface over time.

Edited by Powerflite 2019-04-16 3:32 PM
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2019-04-16 9:41 PM (#580995 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: RE: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5266
50001001002525
Location: So. California
Thinking about the hard chrome plating, I bet the problem is they apply the chrome directly to the crank. I know from my experience at my job that you would get better adhesion if you plate with titanium first, and then chrome plate, or just use titanium instead of chrome. Not sure if the titanium would give you a similar type of wear resistance or not.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
57chizler
Posted 2019-04-17 1:00 PM (#581024 - in reply to #580984)
Subject: RE: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert

Posts: 3138
2000100010025
Location: NorCal
Powerflite - 2019-04-16 12:24 PM

I have been told many times by experienced people not to do hard chrome plating. It eventually wears off and creates debri in your bearings. Not good.


Nonsense. Shaft hard-chroming is widely used in industrial applications to prevent wear. One of the premier hard-chroming facilities was located near me and, for years, I never ran a crank that wasn't hard-chromed.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
di_ch_NY56
Posted 2019-04-19 10:50 AM (#581146 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: RE: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert

Posts: 1230
100010010025
Location: ZH, Switzerland

I just let you know what my engine builder (typically builds really bullet proof race engines). He told me undersize journals and oversize bearing cups are a foule compromise, because the bearing cups are not the same (multilayer bearing cups). The layer thickness are thicker than in stock bearing cups and they wouldn't last as long as stock bearing cups.

Another option in my mind right now is an Imperail 413 engine (running) and exchange the camshaft, distributor, intake and exhaust manifolds.

Dieter

Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2019-04-19 12:21 PM (#581149 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: RE: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5266
50001001002525
Location: So. California
Millions of people used oversize bearings for many thousands of miles. Your machinist is full of it. This chart shows that they increase the shell size to account for changes in bearing size. The layer thicknesses remain the same - even for small changes like .001". The only issue with using oversize bearings is that by cutting the std crank journal surface, you lose the hard nitride outer layer which makes your new crank surface softer and more vulnerable to wear. But it will still wear fine for the amount of miles you are likely to put on the motor, and the reality is that the bearings usually wear out before the crank journals anyway.



(identify.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments identify.jpg (212KB - 0 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
wayfarer
Posted 2019-04-19 6:35 PM (#581162 - in reply to #580923)
Subject: Re: adaptor available for RB with new style crankshaft to A466?



Elite Veteran

Posts: 764
5001001002525
Location: Central Ory-Gun
Well....., there is one adapter for a post-62 RB crank for a pre-62 converter, but you would still need to have a spacer for the block to trans case. Weld the crank or cut it to 0.010 and move on.

I agree. Your machinist is, for some reason, being less than factual.

Under sized bearing are used by the millions every day in this country. I have built blown 392 packages and used them; In fact, I haven't used standard journal sizes in years.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Jump to page : 1
Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page]
Jump to forum :
Search this forum
Printer friendly version
E-mail a link to this thread



(Delete all cookies set by this site)