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Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.
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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2019-09-06 6:29 PM (#587180)
Subject: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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As my regular daily driver, a '73 Dodge Dart, is in my garage for some vinlytop removal and roof-maintainance, I resorted to using my next best daily driver candidate, the 1960 Chrysler New Yorker.
So for over 2 weeks already I've been driving the NewYorker around and using it to commute to work as well.

It's mileage however isn't 'superb' at around 11mpg, but given it has a longrammed and solid roller cammed 496ci stroker-engine under the hood, I don't blame it for the smiles it gives me every day
Tenderfoot-driving is required on wet roads as a little too much throttle during accelerations will break out the rear end.





Getting groceries at the local supermarket;




Not afraid of some menacing looking weather up ahead...!




At the "car wash"..., no wait,... at work, getting a free wash from mother nature...



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slimwhitman
Posted 2019-09-13 11:47 AM (#587483 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I have a friend that made his '59 non-forwardlook into his daily driver a few years ago. It was a nice, solid sedan. After 5 years, he retired it and sold it for parts because it became a dangerous rustbucket. ...just like they did when they were new cars. Here in the Midwest, they rusted and were junk in 5-7 years. As much as I love to drive my old cars, I keep a disposable bad weather car in the fleet to keep the cars I love from a quick death-by-rust.

Perhaps, in other parts of the country or world, you can make an old car an all weather daily driver.
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firedome
Posted 2019-09-13 12:34 PM (#587485 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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The lowered body, matte paint, spoke mags and big tires give it a mean and purposeful look... sweet!
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plymouth
Posted 2019-09-13 2:14 PM (#587489 - in reply to #587485)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I daily drive my 1963 Imperial. No issues here. Rebuilt drivetrain, suspension, front discs, electronic ignition, and it's no different than driving any other car. By the way, you have a beautiful car.

Edited by plymouth 2019-09-13 2:15 PM
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Powerflite
Posted 2019-09-13 2:46 PM (#587491 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I have used most of my cars that are driveable as daily drivers at some point for the same reason as you. I've never had to do it with an 11mpg 496 though! That's a little tough on the wallet. And I don't have bad weather here either, just rain on a rare occasion. I may be doing it again soon with my 18mpg (freeway) Coronet for a while. I took this video when I was daily driving my '61 Lancer wagon to Los Angeles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5yG_-N6410
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big m
Posted 2019-09-13 4:01 PM (#587492 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I've daily driven my old cars since 1979.

Sure, the fuel mileage is poor compared to modern econoboxes, and there is definitely maintenance that needs to be performed.

However, the Benefits of being in a good frame of mind outweigh all the negatives by far.

---John
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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2019-09-13 4:24 PM (#587493 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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If it were up to me (and the locations I visit) I would drive my old cars every day of the week.
Overhere, the car actually costs about €100,- per week to drive (on gasoline). That's $110,- p/week.
This is why LPG Propane is popular on old cars here, it costs one 1/3rd of the price of gasoline.

The car's trunk- and door-seals, being over 50 years old, have hardened and been flattened in their closed shape, so the front doors leak a fair amount of rain and the trunk is no better.
Someone once did a lousy repair on the trunk lip, but left no way of rainwater to run off, so it mostly runs into the trunk. I've put a good coat of rustpreventive primer on the still solid trunk-floor.
Just the other day I touched the carpet on the pass.side and it was soaking wet.
Pulled up the carpet got rid of the water and let it dry. Then put a thick coat of sealing primer on the floorboard, which will be topped by a nice coat of sealing paint.

After I noticed the amount of water in the car I put it indoors again. Time to get a set of new door seals first.

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56D500boy
Posted 2019-09-13 7:03 PM (#587496 - in reply to #587493)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I pretty much daily-drove my 56 Dodge all summer this year. It's looking pretty good and it's fun to drive. And the summer was very dry.

All that said, I didn't and won't drive it on a day that is rainy. I did drive in the rain earlier this week but that was a mistake in the sense that it was sunny when I left home and rain was not in the forecast. I know I still have a leak at the base of the windshield and I won't purposely drive it in the rain until I fix that issue. (It didn't rain hard enough to cause a problem that day).

I have other cars, my 94 Audi V8 quattro 6 spd wagon and my wife's car for rainy days.



Edited by 56D500boy 2019-09-14 1:34 AM
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ABloch
Posted 2019-09-14 1:05 AM (#587499 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Good show Herman! These are cars after all. The reason they exist is to drive them.
And scare the H-E-double hockey sticks out of the other drivers in your case.
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1960fury
Posted 2019-09-14 5:23 AM (#587503 - in reply to #587483)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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slimwhitman - 2019-09-13 11:47 AM

I have a friend that made his '59 non-forwardlook into his daily driver a few years ago. It was a nice, solid sedan. After 5 years, he retired it and sold it for parts because it became a dangerous rustbucket. ...just like they did when they were new cars. Here in the Midwest, they rusted and were junk in 5-7 years. As much as I love to drive my old cars, I keep a disposable bad weather car in the fleet to keep the cars I love from a quick death-by-rust.

Perhaps, in other parts of the country or world, you can make an old car an all weather daily driver.


You can do it everywhere, just a matter of knowing the weak spots and preparation.
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slimwhitman
Posted 2019-09-15 9:19 PM (#587572 - in reply to #587503)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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1960fury - 2019-09-14 4:23 AM

slimwhitman - 2019-09-13 11:47 AM

I have a friend that made his '59 non-forwardlook into his daily driver a few years ago. It was a nice, solid sedan. After 5 years, he retired it and sold it for parts because it became a dangerous rustbucket. ...just like they did when they were new cars. Here in the Midwest, they rusted and were junk in 5-7 years. As much as I love to drive my old cars, I keep a disposable bad weather car in the fleet to keep the cars I love from a quick death-by-rust.

Perhaps, in other parts of the country or world, you can make an old car an all weather daily driver.


You can do it everywhere, just a matter of knowing the weak spots and preparation.


You might not be aware of how they salt our Midwest roads. I take excellent care of my daily drivers, that are usually 30 year old cars themselves, but the salt gets in every nook and cranny. My last car rusted from the inside of the door skins and other inaccessible areas first. I protected the underside and everything I could access, but that wasn't enough.

I would love to hear from someone that lives deep in the rustbelt and daily drives a vintage car. Has anyone in the rustbelt been able to full-time DAILY (snow-salt-rain) a car for 20 years?

Edited by slimwhitman 2019-09-15 9:20 PM
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Powerflite
Posted 2019-09-15 10:22 PM (#587578 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I know what you mean. I drove my '70 Satellite to Utah for a week, and back during Christmas. When I got back, the entire underside of the car was coated in white salt. Not good. I had to put the car up on jack stands and hard spray the entire undercarriage to prevent damage to it. Unfortunately, that's what's required if you want to drive them there. And sealing all the places where that stuff can get in is another issue.
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LD3 Greg
Posted 2019-09-15 11:25 PM (#587587 - in reply to #587578)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.


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Powerflite - 2019-09-15 10:22 PM

I know what you mean. I drove my '70 Satellite to Utah for a week, and back during Christmas. When I got back, the entire underside of the car was coated in white salt. Not good. I had to put the car up on jack stands and hard spray the entire undercarriage to prevent damage to it. Unfortunately, that's what's required if you want to drive them there. And sealing all the places where that stuff can get in is another issue.


Absolutely. And you also know that that white salt seeped into every pinch weld in the entire body of the car. And, you also realize that every time of day that moist air condenses to moisten that salt, corrosion occurs. Set that ball in motion in thaw/freeze repeated cycle environments and all is predictable. Nathan, where you live you are probably safe!! We are not!!

Greg
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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2019-09-16 5:02 AM (#587596 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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For the last 6-7 years, my '73 Dodge Dart has been my daily driver and it's taking a beating every winter.
Rust always comes from the inside of the sheetmetal.
Internal leakages make it really worse. A leaky rear windowseal will let water run deep into the dirty areas of the trunk, lower fenders and dusty wheel-arches, where it starts to attack the metal.
If your car is a bit dirty with salted winter roadspray, this will leak to the inside too.

Here in the Netherlands, roads are salted at the slightest hint of frost at night. Sometimes the roads are whiter just because of the salt then from frost.
Heck, even during our extremely hot summer this year, they used salt again on the roads, just to 'cool' them down a bit so the asphalt doesn't go soft... It seems they are really set of killing as much cars as possible these days.
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1960fury
Posted 2019-09-16 5:48 AM (#587598 - in reply to #587572)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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slimwhitman - 2019-09-15 9:19 PM

1960fury - 2019-09-14 4:23 AM

slimwhitman - 2019-09-13 11:47 AM

I have a friend that made his '59 non-forwardlook into his daily driver a few years ago. It was a nice, solid sedan. After 5 years, he retired it and sold it for parts because it became a dangerous rustbucket. ...just like they did when they were new cars. Here in the Midwest, they rusted and were junk in 5-7 years. As much as I love to drive my old cars, I keep a disposable bad weather car in the fleet to keep the cars I love from a quick death-by-rust.

Perhaps, in other parts of the country or world, you can make an old car an all weather daily driver.


You can do it everywhere, just a matter of knowing the weak spots and preparation.


You might not be aware of how they salt our Midwest roads. I take excellent care of my daily drivers, that are usually 30 year old cars themselves, but the salt gets in every nook and cranny. My last car rusted from the inside of the door skins and other inaccessible areas first. I protected the underside and everything I could access, but that wasn't enough.

I would love to hear from someone that lives deep in the rustbelt and daily drives a vintage car. Has anyone in the rustbelt been able to full-time DAILY (snow-salt-rain) a car for 20 years?


Germany is like the rustbelt. Nasty weather and salted roads. I did drive my 60 Fury for about 10 years daily (90s) without rustthrouhgs. The trunk lid leaked without me noticing it (easily preventable) so there is rust now in the left rear quarter, but not much and it was rusted thru there already when I bought it (poor fix by me as a teenager).

Keep in mind, cars rust mostly from the inside out, so if you know the weak spots, you can protect them with active and passive anti rust protection. I prefer the latter. In case of the 60 Plymouth eyebrows for instance, it is very easy to protect them with rubber flaps. I also covered parts of the underside with sheets of plastic, like on a new car. The underside I painted in several steps, then sprayed with wax. Doors, sills, frame, eye brows, any captivity filled with Mike Sanders penetrating wax. So it is possible, just a matter of preparation.

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57burb
Posted 2019-09-16 1:11 PM (#587612 - in reply to #587598)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Feel free to disagree, but "daily driving" (to me) equates to no longer caring about its condition. I helped a buddy of mine build his dream truck, an '84 Chevy with an LS engine. I know that won't excite anyone here, but that's not the point. We took this thing all the way down to a bare cab and carefully built it back over a year, detailed it nicely, and sprayed it shiny gloss black. This thing was beautiful! And then his real daily driver broke down one day, and he drove it to work... and kept driving it. Now four years later it looks like a sun faded beat up old piece of crap and all that work and his money is wasted.

Understand that I'm not knocking anyone that drives these cars regularly. I do! They should ABSOLUTELY be driven and enjoyed. It's just that leaving them in the sun every day ruins paint and interiors; driving in the rain gets moisture in all the problem areas that wiped out these cars when new; and leaving them alone in parking lots allows people that have zero respect for your car to put their hands and shopping carts all over it. I'm just not going to put my car through that.

It takes a lot of effort and cash to keep these cars in good shape and drive them that often. If you're doing that, more power to ya!
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57plymouth
Posted 2019-09-19 8:22 AM (#587731 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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I daily drove my 57 Plymouth from 1990 to 1998. I still use it a lot. I didn't have a garage to keep it in until 2002. However, in South Carolina we don't salt roads so rust isn't as much of a big deal.

If it had air conditioning, I would probably still daily drive it.
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Powerflite
Posted 2019-09-19 3:51 PM (#587744 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Show us a nice A/C install on your next episode so you can drive it more. I would like to see a good sized evaporator install, not those little add-on accessory style units.
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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2019-09-19 3:52 PM (#587745 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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IMO with daily driven 'old' cars, it's not the condition, but more the originality that will suffer. At least, if you have pride in your ride. With no pride, everything will suffer.
Somewhat similar to the cars in Cuba, only their source of parts is limited.
I find with my '73 Dart, that I will improve its ride-quality/handling, and pretty much everything over time.
I replaced the headlights with LEDs. The Mopar electronic ignition got replaced by a simpler HEI-module (and later on I went digital). The original Mopar "discharging at idle" alternator got replaced by a modern Denso-alternator. Its 904-transmission got replaced with a A518 overdrive transmission. I replaced the worn original 7-1/4" rear end with a narrowed 8-3/4" rear end from a late '60s C-body.
Torsion bars got upgraded. Shocks were replaced with adjustable shocks.
Front brakes were upgraded to C-body rotors and discbrakes.

With every 'original' item that eventually needs to be replaced, I look into improving first (if possible with a newer Mopar-part) while maintaining its dependability for daily use.

But I still hate it when the car's condition (sheetmetal) worsens and rust starts to appear.
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Powerflite
Posted 2019-09-19 5:14 PM (#587749 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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One thing you didn't mention is seatbelts. If you are going to drive something in insane traffic on a daily basis, you need to have good 3-point seat belts. Without them, you are taking a big risk. Risking your car to the elements & traffic is one thing, but risking your life that much isn't acceptable IMO. Fuel injection is also nice for a daily driver so you don't have to deal with cold stumbling, flooding, or spilling fuel around corners etc. But I know people (John is one) that drive them daily in completely stock form. But he doesn't drive an hour each way to work in LA traffic either. A/C is another component that is essential to some people depending on how you use it and when you drive.

I'm surprised you got a C-body rear to fit in there well. You must be using wheels with a whole lot of offset to them. An A-body 8 3/4 would look better. And, I find the overdrive to be unnecessary with an automatic. I pulled the 904 with 2.76 gears out of my '70 Satellite and put a 700R4 with 3.23 gears. The high speed rpms went down slightly, and the fuel mileage was only slightly better too. The benefit of a lock-up converter just about equaled out the drawback of an extra gear and heavier components. Stoplight acceleration was probably a little better, but I didn't really notice it much. Overall, not worth the trouble. Putting a later model 904 with a lockup converter and a lower 1 & 2 gearset with 2.76 gears would probably perform better in the end. But with a manual trans, an overdrive upgrade is almost essential if you do a lot of freeway driving.

Edited by Powerflite 2019-09-19 5:16 PM
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1960fury
Posted 2019-09-20 5:14 AM (#587761 - in reply to #587749)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Powerflite - 2019-09-19 5:14 PM

Fuel injection is also nice for a daily driver so you don't have to deal with cold stumbling, flooding, or spilling fuel around corners etc. But I know people (John is one) that drive them daily in completely stock form.


Well, John and a Billion people around the globe back in the day in times before cell phones. The mentioned things are not part of a normal carburetor function. Anybody who can't tune a simple carb so it works troublefree in daily driving, is not a mechanic, not even an amateur hobbyist.
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57plymouth
Posted 2019-09-20 10:26 AM (#587769 - in reply to #587744)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Powerflite - 2019-09-19 3:51 PM

Show us a nice A/C install on your next episode so you can drive it more.


Because a compressor and a flathead 6 do not mix.
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gwaggoner
Posted 2019-09-20 12:35 PM (#587772 - in reply to #587769)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.


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Other brave souls have tried:

http://p15-d24.com/topic/29644-flathead-ac/

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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2019-09-20 3:57 PM (#587779 - in reply to #587749)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Powerflite - 2019-09-19 11:14 AM

One thing you didn't mention is seatbelts. If you are going to drive something in insane traffic on a daily basis, you need to have good 3-point seat belts. Without them, you are taking a big risk. Risking your car to the elements & traffic is one thing, but risking your life that much isn't acceptable IMO. Fuel injection is also nice for a daily driver so you don't have to deal with cold stumbling, flooding, or spilling fuel around corners etc. But I know people (John is one) that drive them daily in completely stock form. But he doesn't drive an hour each way to work in LA traffic either. A/C is another component that is essential to some people depending on how you use it and when you drive.

I'm surprised you got a C-body rear to fit in there well. You must be using wheels with a whole lot of offset to them. An A-body 8 3/4 would look better. And, I find the overdrive to be unnecessary with an automatic. I pulled the 904 with 2.76 gears out of my '70 Satellite and put a 700R4 with 3.23 gears. The high speed rpms went down slightly, and the fuel mileage was only slightly better too. The benefit of a lock-up converter just about equaled out the drawback of an extra gear and heavier components. Stoplight acceleration was probably a little better, but I didn't really notice it much. Overall, not worth the trouble. Putting a later model 904 with a lockup converter and a lower 1 & 2 gearset with 2.76 gears would probably perform better in the end. But with a manual trans, an overdrive upgrade is almost essential if you do a lot of freeway driving.


I'm taking a big risc everyday by driving an old and marginally designed and built car. Crumple-zones just happen where the support is the weakest. I've seen crashed Mopars before. I now what I'm driving.
Lap belts are in the car, also because they are required by law (from '73 and newer).
The Dart runs on LPG / Propane. Cold (freezin) starts are no issue at all.

I narrowed down the C-body rear-end to A-body width myself and got new axles from Dr. Diff.
The added gear in the transmission makes the car much more fun to drive. It has a 3.55:1 ratio in the rear end.
One drawback is the heavier internals of the OD-transmission. The 8.6:1cr 318ci that was first in the car struggled with the OD and 3.23 gears on the highway. Got better with 3.55 gears.
Now with the 11.3:1cr 360ci I could reinstall the 3.23 gears again as torque is good.

But, even still with the heavier weight of the car, the 496ci in the '60-NY still runs circles around the 360 when it comes the torque and acceleration.
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Powerflite
Posted 2019-09-20 5:10 PM (#587785 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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3 point seat belts were required by law starting in January 1968. My daily driver '69 Corona has them, and so did my spring special '68 Barracuda and '70 Satellite wagon. So your Dart should have them too. If not, it certainly has the mounts in the roof for them, so you could put them back in there and use them. The law here varies by state, but most require you to use what the car came with, and if it was upgraded, to use what it has. So you would be breaking the law by not using the roof strap over here. I know people who have been ticketed for such things, but it is rare because most cops don't know when they came out.

Sid, every Carter 4bbl I own will drip fuel when doing hard cornering. How do you stop that from happening? Changing the top gasket doesn't fix it. All my old cars still use carburetors except my '69 Corona, which is fuel injected.
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BigBlockMopar
Posted 2019-09-20 6:00 PM (#587787 - in reply to #587180)
Subject: Re: Daily driving my '60 NewYorker. Rain or Shine.



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Laws can vary when you're halfway across the planet sometimes
Every car I have bought had seatbelts, including the '60-NY.

In The Netherlands, all cars built after 1971 (I said '73 above, but it's actually '71) require to have seatbelts. No type of seatbelt is specified, so lap belts are fine.
From '75 and newer, 3-point seatbelts became required for the front seats.
But if a pre-'71 car did come with seatbelts, you are required to wear them during driving. But if they are removed (on pre '71 cars), the requirement to wear them is gone too.
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