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Lights flickering
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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-23 2:43 PM (#610281)
Subject: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

I have been fighting light problems for a while. My dash lights only work when they want to & it usually involves spinning & wiggling the headlight switch. Now it just started the other day but when I turn the running lights or headlights on, all of the lights flicker like crazy including the dome light if the door is open. My ammeter & voltmeter (added) both bounce around like crazy also. I'm worried if the car is safe to drive even during the day when I am not using the headlights, don't want to burn it down. It definitely only happens when I turn the lights on so I think it may be something to do with the headlight switch. I replaced my dash lights with LEDs last year & things worked well enough so I don't think it's those. I just got a set of H4 headlights from a friend & swapped those in but it does this with those or regular headlights in so I don't think it's that. These switches are almost impossible to find & tend to be very expensive so I want to be sure that is the problem before buying one. Anyone have any experience like this? Any help is greatly appreciated. I am scared to drive the car until I figure this out.
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wizard
Posted 2021-03-23 3:00 PM (#610282 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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The H4 headlights consumes too much for the lightswitch and the built in circuite breaker. If you don't installed a relay, then you must!!!

It's either the above and bad contact on the feed wire to the light switch.
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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-23 4:26 PM (#610285 - in reply to #610282)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

I put the other headlights back in it last night & it was still doing it.
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wizard
Posted 2021-03-23 4:45 PM (#610287 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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So, the problem is on the lightswitch feed wire. If you are going to use H4, you must install a relay, otherwise the circuit breaker will cut out the light - kind of scary in the middle of the night.....
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56D500boy
Posted 2021-03-23 4:56 PM (#610288 - in reply to #610287)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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wizard - 2021-03-23 1:45 PM
So, the problem is on the lightswitch feed wire. If you are going to use H4, you must install a relay, otherwise the circuit breaker will cut out the light - kind of scary in the middle of the night.....


While, I do not disagree with the potential need for a relay, it is really dependent on the bulbs. I put H4 headlight housings in my 56 Dodge but instead of the heavy current-draw Halogen bulbs that came with the housings, I installed low current draw (but very bright LED bulbs). No need for a relay.

Low beam LEDs:



The bulbs that I am running:



REFERENCE: http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=70107&...

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wizard
Posted 2021-03-23 5:22 PM (#610290 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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A relay, properly installed will give the battery tension to the headlights, without a relay you will have a current loss through the circuit and lightswitch.
Before I installed relays I measured 9, 8,5 volts at the headlights - after installing the relay I had full battery current at the headlights.

That made my oem sealed beams significally better.

When I switched to LED's I didn't remove the relays.

Even if the LED's dont really need a relay, it's better to use the old lightswitch just as signal circuit
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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-23 8:07 PM (#610293 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

I am planning on adding relays this spring but I still need to solve my current issue. My lights flicker like crazy & my ammeter bounces all over the place even if I just turn on my parking lights. Which wire is the lightswitch feed wire?
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56D500boy
Posted 2021-03-23 9:23 PM (#610295 - in reply to #610293)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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phish1270 - 2021-03-23 5:07 PM
I am planning on adding relays this spring but I still need to solve my current issue. My lights flicker like crazy & my ammeter bounces all over the place even if I just turn on my parking lights. Which wire is the lightswitch feed wire?


Glenn: Your issue might just be the regulator isn't working properly.

What is the car, year and model? We might be able to help more re:wiring if we knew what the beast we are dealing with.

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wizard
Posted 2021-03-24 1:24 AM (#610300 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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Does the lights flicker with the engine running only or also when the engine is shut off?

Another thing might be bad contact on the wires to the ammeter.

Typically, the feed goes from the battery to the starter relay terminal B and then to the ammeter terminal B.
From the ammeter output the feed goes to the B terminal on the lightswitch (thick wire) and all electrical consumers in the car.
From the B terminal on the lightswitch to the BAT terminal on the generator regulator and thereby closing the circuit.

It's important that all the connection points have good contact, free from rust and/or vredigris.

A bad connection in any of those connection points will create excessive heat, hence a risk of wire fires which in turn will cause severe danger for an uncontrolled fire.

You should install a negative battery pole disconnector for to protect the car when parked.
If you install a fuselink wire circuit, it will also protect the car when you drive it.

The horn feed wire is "hot" and should have it's own fuselink
The wire from the B terminal to the ammeter is "hot" and should have it's own fuselink.

Hope this will help you out
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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-24 8:01 PM (#610328 - in reply to #610295)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

It is a 1961 Dart. I put old style headlights back in for now. I pulled the headlight switch yesterday & cleaned everything up, reinstalled it tonight & it's still doing it. My brake lights work fine, turn signals work but everything goes crazy when I turn even just the parking lights on. It happens whether the car is running or not. I have the car in my shop now & had the garage door closed, I noticed that my taillights are not working at all. Again, brake lights & turn signals (front & back) all work fine when other lights are off. I'm thinking it's either a short in taillight line or in headlight switch. Friday I will disconnect black wire at headlight switch, it is for taillights & see what happens. If problem goes away then it could be a short in taillight wiring. I have no idea how since everything used to work fine but who knows. Could I swap black wire (taillights) with lt. green (headlights) or yellow (front parking lights) on headlight switch to see if that isolates the problem? They would all be hot feeds only when switch is pulled. Thanks for all of the help so far guys. I am hoping ro continue upgrading & safeguarding things as I can but obviously need to figure this current situation out.
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56D500boy
Posted 2021-03-24 8:43 PM (#610329 - in reply to #610328)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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.
1961 Wiring Diagrams (in case you do not have them)



Edited by 56D500boy 2021-03-24 8:47 PM




(61Dodge_6[1]Small.jpg)



(61Dodge_V8[1]_Small.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments 61Dodge_6[1]Small.jpg (220KB - 198 downloads)
Attachments 61Dodge_V8[1]_Small.jpg (234KB - 193 downloads)
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wizard
Posted 2021-03-25 2:23 AM (#610333 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering



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A short cut in the light circuit will trigger the built in circuit breaker in the lightswitch. The circuit breaker will start to work like a turn signal relay.
The bi-metal in the cricuit breaker becomes hot by the short circuit and/or over load, thereby opening the contacts for to protect the wires from burning.
When the contacts are open, the bi-metal will immedeately cool down and close the contacts/circuit again. If the short circuit/over load remains, then the cykle will be repeated over and over again.
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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-25 8:31 AM (#610337 - in reply to #610333)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

wizard - 2021-03-25 2:23 AM

A short cut in the light circuit will trigger the built in circuit breaker in the lightswitch. The circuit breaker will start to work like a turn signal relay.
The bi-metal in the cricuit breaker becomes hot by the short circuit and/or over load, thereby opening the contacts for to protect the wires from burning.
When the contacts are open, the bi-metal will immedeately cool down and close the contacts/circuit again. If the short circuit/over load remains, then the cykle will be repeated over and over again.


That is what I think is happening, you can actually hear it, so there is a short either in the wiring or in the switch. It looks like each wire at the switch powers different parts of the lighting circuit so I should be able to disconnect one wire at a time & see if it fixes the problem. I am thinking I should start with the taillight wire, the black one first. If the problem stops then there is a short either in the taillight wiring or the contact on the switch. I wonder if I could hook the black wire up in place of the yellow, which powers the front parking lights. That would tell me if the short is in the wiring or in the switch. Looks like I will be busy this weekend. It does seem like the car is safe to drive during the day as long as I don't turn the lights on, just in case I need to take it out for any reason. Thanks for all the help so far guys. Stay tuned . . . . .
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ronbo97
Posted 2021-03-25 10:10 AM (#610338 - in reply to #610337)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Yes, it seems that you are correctly diagnosing the problem. Once you've identified where the issue is, I would recommend rewiring the car. It sounds like your wiring is old and brittle. This would especially be an issue if the car came from desert country. Use correct gauge and color wire. Don't jury-rig. If this is something you don't want to tackle, you can buy the correct harness from YnZ or Rhode Island Wiring. Expensive, though.

Ron

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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-29 9:31 AM (#610489 - in reply to #610281)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

It was a productive busy weekend. I disconnected the black wire, the taillight feed, turned on the lights & no more flickering. So there was something wrong with either the taillight wiring or the taillight feed at the switch. I pulled the headlight switch, cleaned everything, soaked it overnight with penetrating fluid, took the rheostat out & cleaned it up. Put everything back together. I did a continuity test on every wire in the taillight feed, everything was good. My wiring is in very good shape, nothing is brittle or frayed. Put switch back in, tightened the main power feed really well & hooked up all the wiring. Turned my lights on & the problem is gone. I went through all of the wiring & everything tested good. Took the car out for a couple hours cruising around Saturday, occasionally driving with all of the lights on & no more flickering issues. I am not 100% what I fixed other than cleaning up the rheostat, lubricating the switch & tightening the main power feed on the switch but everything is working, actually better than before. Fingers crossed for now & I will keep an eye on things. Now onto some electrical upgrades & safeguards. Thanks for all of the help & advice guys.
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ronbo97
Posted 2021-03-29 10:47 AM (#610498 - in reply to #610489)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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I would bet corrosion on the rheostat.

Ron

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phish1270
Posted 2021-03-30 8:25 AM (#610526 - in reply to #610498)
Subject: Re: Lights flickering


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Posts: 21

ronbo97 - 2021-03-29 10:47 AM

I would bet corrosion on the rheostat.

Ron



It's working better now than it has since I bought the car. Funny how the littlest things excite us.
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