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Rear Axle End Play Help, Please
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57Fireflite
Posted 2022-02-20 10:08 PM (#619619)
Subject: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please


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Howdy Fellow Forward Lookers,

I've scoured this forum, the shop manual and the interwebs for details on setting rear axle end play. Here's where I stand on this project (when I started, the driver's side was the only side with .050" of shims -- one .030" and two .010"):

1. Replaced the rear bearings with new; installed to the shoulder on the axle.
2. Replaced inner and outer seals.
3. Per shop manual, installed .040" in shims on one side (driver's) per shop manual and used backing plate to drive the race in squarely.
4. Fully seated the passenger side race (flush to flange) with no preload, axle turns easy. Nowhere near the ~.040” the shop manual says the race ought to be sticking out from the flange.
5. Using the backing plate as a proxy to the C-413 tool that you’re supposed to put the feeler gauge between it and the flange, I can fit .0015”, but not .0025".

Result:
Out of desperation for some evidence that I'm doing it right, I set up the dial indicator.
Driver side is ~.009/.010” and passenger side is ~.018” — with no shim (measurement taken after tapping drivers side axle with a rubber mallet).

Questions:
Am I close to correct on this? Am I in spec?
I don't see how adding shims is going to help given the races are wedged in so tightly.
I've read that axle end play is the sum of the two numbers. Is that true/correct?

Any and all advice appreciated. Thanks!

~Jimbo
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Shep
Posted 2022-02-21 10:36 AM (#619625 - in reply to #619619)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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Read thru this. https://p15-d24.com/topic/51068-rear-axle-bearing-cups-end-play/
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57chizler
Posted 2022-02-21 12:44 PM (#619632 - in reply to #619619)
Subject: RE: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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57Fireflite - 2022-02-20 7:08 PM
Questions:
Am I close to correct on this? Am I in spec?
I don't see how adding shims is going to help given the races are wedged in so tightly.
I've read that axle end play is the sum of the two numbers. Is that true/correct?

Any and all advice appreciated. Thanks!


There is a floating thrust block in the differential between the axle shafts. To correctly measure the end play you should smack one axle end to firmly seat the opposite side bearing race against the backing plate then do the same on the opposite side; with both races seated the end play measured with a dial indicator will be the same when measured from either side.
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Shep
Posted 2022-02-21 1:20 PM (#619634 - in reply to #619632)
Subject: RE: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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Correct.
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57Fireflite
Posted 2022-02-21 2:42 PM (#619641 - in reply to #619619)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please


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Thanks, Shep, Chizler -- will thoroughly review today after work and keep you posted.

Appreciate your wisdom and experience...
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57Fireflite
Posted 2022-02-21 10:41 PM (#619653 - in reply to #619619)
Subject: RE: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please


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Thanks again for the reading material and the advice. After review, I set aside the Shop Manual mandate requiring .040" on one side to start:

Removed ALL shims and tightened down backing plate to 35 ft. lbs., malleted the axles and re-measured getting .013" - .014" -- spec calls for .013"-.018"

TECHNICALLY, it's within spec and Shop Manual says shims come in minimum .005" thickness; is it worth getting one to up the play to the other end of the spectrum? Better if some .001"s were to be had...

So, do I send it as-is? Or add some thin shims?

Again, any and all advice appreciated.
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Shep
Posted 2022-02-22 8:22 AM (#619660 - in reply to #619653)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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You are done, no need to play with it any more.
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57chizler
Posted 2022-02-22 12:43 PM (#619669 - in reply to #619660)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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I've always thought you're better off at the minimum end play. The front wheel bearings are the same design and they run from zero to a few thou end play.
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1960fury
Posted 2022-02-22 3:42 PM (#619683 - in reply to #619669)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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57chizler - 2022-02-22 12:43 PM

I've always thought you're better off at the minimum end play. The front wheel bearings are the same design and they run from zero to a few thou end play.


Me too! Especially with disc brakes. The axles do not get that hot and the question is, aren't the axle shafts/thrust block "growing" too when hot? Never checked a hot axle.
Anyway, that shifting around during cornering when cold (it takes very long until the axles warm up, especially in winters) can't be a good thing.
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Shep
Posted 2022-02-22 5:06 PM (#619686 - in reply to #619683)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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I ran that clearance in my 55 Chrysler and a 59 Dodge I rebuilt for friend, my car ran 15k, no issues and the 59 about 30 k over 15 years.
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57Fireflite
Posted 2022-02-22 5:18 PM (#619688 - in reply to #619619)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please


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Excellent!
Thanks again all for the advice and confirmation that I can button this bad boy up! You've been life savers...
So relieved...! ??
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Powerflite
Posted 2022-02-22 7:28 PM (#619691 - in reply to #619619)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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I agree, I've run them starting at .008" with no issues. The other thing to take into account is I have found that clearances increase with use - mainly because there are small imperfections that are preventing you from getting the full range. But with use, those small imperfections get worn off or eliminated. So if you set it at the high end and come back to measure it a month later, it's now too loose and out of spec.
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Shep
Posted 2022-02-22 7:33 PM (#619692 - in reply to #619691)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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True, normal wear in.
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1960fury
Posted 2022-02-22 7:48 PM (#619694 - in reply to #619691)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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Powerflite - 2022-02-22 7:28 PM

I agree, I've run them starting at .008" with no issues. The other thing to take into account is I have found that clearances increase with use - mainly because there are small imperfections that are preventing you from getting the full range. But with use, those small imperfections get worn off or eliminated. So if you set it at the high end and come back to measure it a month later, it's now too loose and out of spec.


First of all there is of course bearing wear, that is probably highest the first few 1000 miles, until the race and the rollers are "mated" and because of the tapered design of the bearing it will provide a lot more clearance than in a non tapered bearing.
Also, I do not think, a few hits with a mallet on the shaft can provide the force of hard high speed cornering.
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1960fury
Posted 2022-02-23 9:16 AM (#619715 - in reply to #619683)
Subject: Re: Rear Axle End Play Help, Please



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1960fury - 2022-02-22 3:42 PM

57chizler - 2022-02-22 12:43 PM

I've always thought you're better off at the minimum end play. The front wheel bearings are the same design and they run from zero to a few thou end play.


Me too! Especially with disc brakes. The axles do not get that hot and the question is, aren't the axle shafts/thrust block "growing" too when hot? Never checked a hot axle.
Anyway, that shifting around during cornering when cold (it takes very long until the axles warm up, especially in winters) can't be a good thing.


Of course I meant to say, isn't the axle HOUSING expanding too when hot.
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