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 In Search of engine numbers for 56-58 Dual-Ghias with 56 D500 engninesJump to page : 1 Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page] | View previous thread :: View next thread |
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56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 10540    Location: Lower Mainland BC | . While I was trying to help a fellow “Matt” find an oil pan for a Dual-Ghia that he is involved with the restoration thereof, I bumped into a bunch of Dual-Ghias on the internet. Some had more information in their write-ups available than others. Some had lots of photos and even information about their engines, i.e. 315 D500 hemis or 315 polys, some, but not many, had engine numbers. I noted the D500 engine numbers with the intent of adding them to my D500 engine number “registry”. I didn’t really care about the poly engine numbers other than to note them as D633-nnnnn numbers. Typically the photos show the Carter WCFB 4 bbl carb, indicating the 230 hp engine for a poly and the 260 hp for the D500 hemis. In their Dual-Ghia history write-up in Automobile Quarterly (Vol.35, No.3, July 1996) John Matras and Dr. Paul Sable (a noted Dual-Ghia expert), mention on page 92 that the base engine was the 230 hp 4 bbl 315 “wedge” engine (apparently even “experts” don’t know/realize the difference between “wedge” and “polyspherical” ). Which is a bit ironic because that statement sits below a photo of a Dual-Ghia engine bay which clearly shows a 315 hemi (that is captioned “The standard powerplant for the Dual-Ghia was a 315cid 260 hp Dodge V-8”. (See scan below) They then went on to state that Dual Motors (Eugene Cassaroll’s company putting the Dual-Ghia together) ordered 50 of “each engine”, i.e. 50 230 hp 56 Dodge 315 4 bbl polys and 50 260 hp 56 Dodge 315 4 bbl D500 hemis (“double rocker”). Since only about 117 Dual-Ghias were made (maybe 100 VIN’d cars and 15 to 17 prototypes), that meant some extra engines had to be sourced from somewhere over the late 56-early 58 production run. What those were, I have some ideas but no real clue. All of the factory Dual-Ghia engines that I have seen were painted a red-orange with creamy beige valve covers and, in the case of the D500 engines, black wire covers. When searching for engine numbers, I did find some photos of Dual Ghias with Chrome valve covers but I don’t think that that was factory. (Maybe) ?? Another engine Dual-Ghia comment from elsewhere: “The Dual-Ghia used a shortened Dodge passenger car chassis. Dodge also provided the Hemi engine and Powerflite transmission. This made for an impressive package, especially since the optional Dodge D-500 Hemi's horsepower ratings were consistently higher than those of the Corvette.” (side note: In 1956 the Corvette with the 265 small block and 2 4 bbl carbs only made 225 hp) Reference: https://www.hotrod.com/features/mopp-0801-1958-handbuilt-dual-ghia/ And yet another comment: “Under the hood, most Dual-Ghias hid either the standard or high-performance version of Dodge's reliable, 315-ci (5.2 liters) Red Ram V8. Though the standard dual-carb Red Ram featured polyspheric combustion chambers, the four-barrel carb high-performance version dibbed D500 had HEMI heads. In the D500 setup, the Red Ram pushed out 260 hp and 330 lb-ft (447 Nm) of torque. This was enough for a 0 to 60 mph (97 kph) sprint of around 8.5 seconds and a top speed of 120 mph (193 kph). From 1957 to the end of production, some cars were equipped with the newer, more powerful 361-ci (5.9 liters) Super Red Ram "B" engine. This big-block V8, rated at 320 hp, turned the Dual-Ghia into a veritable sports car.” Reference: https://www.autoevolution.com/news/dual-ghia-the-hemi-powered-italia... As I went along, searching for more Dual-Ghias with 56 D500 engines, preferably write-ups with D500-nnnn engine numbers, I bumped into at least one D500 dressed as a D500-1 with one of the rare (only 100 made) dual 4 bbl manifolds with 2 Carter WCFBs and one engine bay showing a “B” block engine (361 or 383 ??) with Dual quads. Going back to the Matras and Sable article, they said that Paul Farago (who designed hybrid Dual-Ghia chassis) had said that “no cars (Dual-Ghias) were delivered with dual four-barrel carburetors.” Oddly, the Dual-Ghia Automobile Manufacturers Association sheets list the 4 bbl 315 poly as having 240 hp whereas Dodge just listed that engine as 230 hp. If the 10 hp difference could attributed to the exhaust system (2.25”) then it is curious that the 260 hp D500 engine wasn’t upped to 270 hp in accordance. Who knows what went on back then. ?? Some of the info and/or photos that I accumulated. Still looking for D500 engine numbers. Edited by 56D500boy 2024-12-05 9:59 PM (DualGhia_104_RightFront.jpg) (DrSableOnDualGhiaEngines_Annotated.jpg) (DualGhia163With315Poly.jpg) (DualGhiaWithD500hemi_CleanEngineBay.jpg) (DualGhia141_Engine_DressedAsAD500-1.jpg) (DualGhia150_EngineBayWith361or383SuperD500Engine_small.jpg) (56DodgeAMA1_GeneralSpecs_NoteEngineHPs.jpg) (DualGhiaAMASpecSheets_1.jpg) (DualGhiaEngineNumberList_Dec5_2024.jpg) Attachments ----------------  DualGhia_104_RightFront.jpg (142KB - 76 downloads) DrSableOnDualGhiaEngines_Annotated.jpg (148KB - 79 downloads) DualGhia163With315Poly.jpg (147KB - 78 downloads) DualGhiaWithD500hemi_CleanEngineBay.jpg (148KB - 79 downloads) DualGhia141_Engine_DressedAsAD500-1.jpg (149KB - 83 downloads) DualGhia150_EngineBayWith361or383SuperD500Engine_small.jpg (146KB - 80 downloads) 56DodgeAMA1_GeneralSpecs_NoteEngineHPs.jpg (147KB - 83 downloads) DualGhiaAMASpecSheets_1.jpg (146KB - 81 downloads) DualGhiaEngineNumberList_Dec5_2024.jpg (148KB - 77 downloads) | ||
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| tailfins |
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Expert Posts: 1838   Location: calif | |||
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| 56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 10540 Location: Lower Mainland BC | . Thanks for your input Charlie. Much appreciated. Great to hear you still have a Dual Ghia. I tried to contact Paul Sable through the Dual-Ghia website but, so far, no reply. Maybe I need a better email for him (If you have one, PM me here at the Forward Look).  | ||
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