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 Summarizing my problems with my 56 Dodge D500 315 hemi lifters and pushrodsJump to page : 1 Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page] | View previous thread :: View next thread |
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56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 11182     Location: Lower Mainland BC | . Sorry but I need to do this to consolidate in my own mind what transpired over the past 5 or 6 weeks when I discovered that I had a backfire issue that seemingly came out of the blue. 1. The first thing that I did was assume that the issue was the No. 8 intake lifter that had confused me when adjusting the solid lifters in my 56 D500 engine nine years ago. 2. That required removal of the intake manifold and valley cover as well as the passenger side spark plugs and valve cover. 3. That done, I discovered that the No. 8 intake lifter was indeed a hydraulic lifter and it had lost its center piston retaining clip. Having no spares, I had to seek out a new lifter. 4. Based on a previous post by Steve B. in Australia, it was determined that the broken lifter could be replaced with a Melling JB-812 or Mopar 2808 569. I sourced both alternatives. This is how they stacked up against what I though the other 15 lifters were, i.e. OE 56 D500 solid lifters: Based on that comparison and the closeness of the "As Found" (from the No. 4 intake) and the JB-812, I chose to replace the No. 8 intake lifter with a JB-812. Note the No. 4 intake lifter was NOT a solid lifter but it was stuck (in the UP position - making it effectively a solid lifter) 5. Before I buttoned the engine back up, I removed the No. 2, No. 4 and No. 6 intake lifters and discovered that they were all stuck hydraulic lifters. I cleaned each of them and filled them with oil and pumped them up (in an oil bath) before installing them back in the engine and adjusting them to hydraulic standards, i.e. zero lash plus 1/4" turn on the adjusting screw. 6. Buttoned the engine back up and started it back up. *POP*. No change. Back fire was still there. Can't say I wasted my time with No. 8 intake but it was NOT the source of the backfire problem. 7. This time I got smart and checked which cylinder was causing the backfire by pulling the spark plug leads at the valve cover for the 2,4,6, and 8 cylinders and the distributor cap for 1, 3 , 5 and 7. The problem was determined to be No. 3 (wasn't sure if it was intake or exhaust but it was definitely No. 3). 8. After a period of whinging, I removed the generator/PS pump combo, battery and wire covers so I could remove the odd (left/driver's side) valve cover. 9. That exposed the actual problem: A broken exhaust push rod on No. 3. 10. Now the challenge was to find a replacement push rod. And that was a real challenge. i) I found a NOS 56 D500 push rod but after it was delivered I found out that it was too tall to be compatible with JB-812 hydraulic lifter. ii) I was pointed to a Melling MPR-448 push rod that normally lives in a Dodge Cummings diesel 6 cyl engine. Skookum but too long (but could be cut down) iii) Next try was a Melling 500074 which was a bit shorter than the MPR - 448 but would still have to be modified (shortened) a bit. iv) Eventually I got smart and spoke to a Melling tech rep ("Brian") who pointed me to part of their website that can be used to determine the best push rod for your situation. I played with that a bit and it seemed to come back with either and MPR-211 or MPR-212. These also showed up in a table in the Melling website: 11: Because of the rocker arm adjusting screw on the 56 D500 engines, either the MPR-211 or -212 might have worked. Moot point because I could only find the MPR-211s on the web (none locally). Bought 4 from AutoZone who provided excellent service and surprisingly fast shipping. 12: After getting them, I tried I tried a 211 in No. 1 and it was fine. However, when I rotated No. 3 to TDC and tried a 211 there, it would not go. Too tall. Obviously an issue with the No. 3 exhaust lifter. 13. That meant that the intake manifold and valley cover had to come off (again). I pulled the No. 3 exhaust lifter out to find that a) it was a hydraulic lifter, b) it too was missing its piston retaining clip and c) it was failed UP UP UP (the internal piston was well above the top of the lifter and would not go down) Replaced that lifter with another Melling JB-812 and a MPR-211 push rod. At that point I had finally realized that ALL of my D500 "Solid" lifters were, in reality, hydraulic lifters that were likely just stuck. Not having more JB-812s and being reluctant to throw a mix of 2808 569s in there, I decided to remove, clean, oil, pump up and return all of the 14 non-JB-812 lifters (7 on each side by now). 14. In going through the non-812 lifters, I found a strange situation with No. 7 intake was way too loose. I didn't figure it out for a bit but eventually, I did. The No. 7 lifter piston was stuck down and no amount of cajoling or tapping would pop the piston out. Since it still had its wire piston retaining clip and I was out of Melling 812s, I decided to steal the clip from No. 7 intake lifter and use it on what I thought was the original problem (which it wasn't) No. 8 intake lifter. No.8 intake lifter is now No. 7 intake lifter. 15. After going through each cylinder's lifters and cleaning, soaking them (in 10W30) and pumping them up, they got reinstalled with their original push rods (with the exception of No. 1 and No. 3 exhaust that got Melling 211s), they all got adjusted like real hydraulic lifters, i.e. zero lash plus 1/4 turn on the adjusting screw. 16. After re-installing the valve covers and the valley pan, the intake and the carb, etc. the engine fired up just fine. NO BACK FIRES. YAY!! After all that, I contacted Hot Hemi Heads and ordered a set of D500 solid lifters (Melling 2084s) and D500 push rods (different lengths than these ones). Some day I might install them - but not right now, I just want to drive my car. REFERENCES: Any "Gotchas" when removing a solid lifter from an exposed lifter gallery? http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=78242&... Adjusting 56 D500 solid lifter valves and discovering a GOTCHA http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=80645&... Searching for alternatives to OE 56 Dodge D500 intake and exhaust push rods http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=80678&... Hope that helps somebody (maybe even me) Now I can put all the extra lifters and push-rods away in a safe place (never to be found again)  Edited by 56D500boy 2026-05-11 9:53 PM | ||
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| JedRhule |
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Veteran Posts: 140 Location: Palm Beach County Florida | |||
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| 56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 11182 Location: Lower Mainland BC | JedRhule - 2026-05-11 5:27 PM What determines if an engine has solid or hydraulic lifters from the factory? I have hydraulic in my Poly with no adjustor screws on the rocker arms. The 56 D500 double-rocker engine was, in some regards, unique. The 55 Super Red Ram Dodge double rocker 270 cu in engine used hydraulic lifters (no adjustment). Likewise the 57 Dodge D500 325 cu in double rocker was hydraulic lifter. So of the 1953 to 1957 Dodge double rocker (hemi) engines, ONLY the 56 D500 engines left the factory with solid lifters, presumably part of the package that took the 230 hp 4 bbl Super-powered Super Red Ram 1956 Dodge poly to the lofty heights of 260 hp (with the better flowing double rocker heads). My car, equipped from the factory with the D500 double rocker engine would have had solid lifters. Somewhere in the life of my car, the engine was rebuilt and during that process, hydraulic lifters were apparently (unknown to me until receontly) installed.  | ||
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| Mopar1 |
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Expert Posts: 3185  Location: N.W. Fla. | |||
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| 56D500boy |
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Exner Expert 10K+ Posts: 11182 Location: Lower Mainland BC | Mopar1 - 2026-05-13 6:02 AM. Have you checked to see if the solid cam was swapped out for a hyd one during the rebuild? Not yet. I am aware of an old thread about D500 cams (hydraulic and solid) http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=38305 And Dave H. has encouraged me to figure it out because of potential conflicts between hydraulic cams and solid lifters and solid lifter cams and hydraulic lifters. At this point, the engine is running with 16 hydraulic lifters (14 of which were in the engine when I bought the car in 2016, about 8000 miles ago). I would be very reluctant to replace the cam to make everything copacetic, assuming that I could find a solid lifter 56 D500 1731 594 cam if it turns out that the rebuilders used a 56 315 poly cam, PN 1619 723. The only cam specs that I know of are shown in this (pg. 5 of the 56 Dodge AMA questionnaire) (56DodgeAMASpecSheets_Pg.5.jpg) Attachments ----------------  56DodgeAMASpecSheets_Pg.5.jpg (219KB - 91 downloads) | ||
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