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 Conversion of a 56 Chrysler, Desoto or Dodge D500 to front discs using a Scarebird Bracket KitJump to page : 1 Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page] | View previous thread :: View next thread |
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56D500boy |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 9956      Location: Lower Mainland BC | . For many of you, this might be boring or inconsequential. For me, I have been fighting against making this conversion since probably January 2022 and need to document what I have done. Initially, I wanted to keep the integrity of my car's D500 Special package intact, i.e. the D500 315 hemi ("double rocker") engine and the Chrysler 12 x 2.5" Center Plane drum brakes. However, I have had recurring issues with the Center Plane brakes after lack of use (over the winter). Normally I have been able to overcome/power through these issues and move on for a summer of driving pleasure. That is until this spring when I got the car out of the garage for the first time in 2024. I got about 10 feet and the right front locked on very hard and would not release. It was very ug-A-Lee. Trust me. Car had to be left on the street beside the house for the only time since I owned it (Sept. 2016). I hated doing that to a friend. Within a few days, I fixed the problem (rehabbed the wheel cylinders and installed new return springs) but by then my trust in the Center Plane system was totally gone. Time to finally go to the front discs that I had been toying with but resisting for a few years. I had previously investigated conversion options using either AAJ (Roger)'s kit (brackets and hardware) or Scarebird's kit (brackets and similar hardware). I decided to use the Scarebird bracket kit for this conversion. While Roger's AAJ kit was made specifically for 56 Chryslers and Desotos, the Scarebird bracket kit was actually designed for 57 to 61 Mopars, not 56s, let alone 56 Dodge D500s. One thing that needs to be pointed out is the king pin uprights ("supports") and spindle/knuckle on my 56 Dodge D500 are the same as the 1956 Chrysler and Desotos. The only difference is the steering linkage knuckle arms (Left and Right) on the D500 are different than the 56 Chrysler and Desoto steering linkage knuckle arms. This is a minor issue and is easily accommodated. In either application, the 56 Chrysler/Desoto or the 56 Dodge D500, the Scarebird brackets need minor clearancing grinding to eliminate a small zone of conflict between the bracket and the steering linkage knuckle arms. I guess it is time to introduce the Scarebird bracket and its originally intended target, the 57-61 Mopar upright. First the Scarebird kit (when I bought it in late 2021), bracket and some pertinent hardware, especially the spindle adapter the fits over the spindle and accomodates the new rotor (77 Chrysler Cordoba) This is the intended application. Note how the steering arm bolts *TO* the knuckle. In the 56 Chrysler/Desoto and Dodge D500 applications, the steering arm bolts *INTO* the knuckle. This photo also shows the 1990 Chevrolet Celebrity V6 single piston caliper as well as the 77 Chrysler Cordoba 11.75" rotor. Here is a quick look at a 56 Chrysler upright and steering arm during a trial fit of the 57-61 Mopar Scarebird bracket: So in prepping for this conversion, the first thing is to clearance the bracket for the intended application, i.e. 56 Chrysler/Desoto or 56 Dodge D500. I used an angle grinder with a "Zip" cut-off blade to do the clearancing. Lots of trial and error and checking and grinding and grinding and checking. Used a bead of white lithium grease applied to the conflict area on the steering arm to identify the area on the bracket that needed a bit of grinding. Eventually (after about 20 minutes (or less)) you succeed. Here is what the 56 Chrysler/Desoto clearancing looks like: Here is what the 56 Dodge D500 clearancing looks like (similar but different than the 56 Chrysler/Desoto clearancing): Of course, you can't do the clearancing unless you've removed all the Center Plane goodies, leaving you looking a just the face of the spindle/knuckle and the steering arm. So now I have add the new photos independent of my words. Here goes: Obviously the first thing is to remove the wheel, the brake drum and the Center Plane backing plate complete with wheel cylinders and brake shoes, etc. The you can do the bracket clearancing. Once you are happy with the clearancing (In my case when I was no longer getting transfer of white lithium grease from the steering arm to the bracket), then you can bolt the bracket to the spindle/knuckle. Before that happened for me, I cleaned the attachment face of the knuckle and filed off and OE "burrs" at the edges to make the face completely flat. I also cleaned and painted the upright and the back of the spindle/knuckle while it was clear. I used new grade 8 bolts (7/16" x 1.5" x 20 UNF) but the OE Center Plane deep nuts and lock washers (bolt heads are 5/8" and the OE nuts are 11/16"). I also used a tad of Blue LocTite onthe bolt threads - just because. The 1.5" long bolts were longer than needed but 1" bolts were too short and I could NOT find 1.25" Grade 8 bolts locally. I torqued them to the factory 35 lb-ft spec (from the 56 Chrysler FSM). Moving along, next up was adding the Scarebird spindle adapter to the spindle. I had previously investigated both the Scarebird and AAJ adapters and found them to be very much the same (subtle but not substantive differences). Right or wrong, I used a bit of blue LocTite on in inside of the adapter even though the adapter fit very well (as had the AAJ adapter in my previous investigations). Obviously, I could not have started this conversion without having the necessary parts on hand. I did. I had used the Scarebird parts list to order the rotors, the calipers, the bearings, the seals, the brake pads and the hoses from Rock Auto so when I finally started the conversion I had everything on hand. (List and details shown below). I packed the A-2 and A-17 bearings with high fiber red grease (Lucas) and after adding the A-17 bearing to the back side of the Cordoba rotor, I added the 5121 seal. That all done, the rotor was installed on to the 56 Chrysler/Desoto/D500 spindle and the A-2 bearing added. I reused the OE keyed spindle washer and was thinking about using the OE spindle nut but, in the end, opted for the spindle nut supplied by Scarebird. It has deeper slots to accomodate the cotter pin. I used a 29 mm 1/2" drive 6 point socket to adjust the pre-load on the bearings. I think I am happy with my end point (one slot looser was too loose and one slot tighter wasn't happening). Next step was adding the pads to the caliper and the caliper to the bracket (after cleaning the rotor thoroughly with Brake Clean). I used this video starting at the 1:47 mark as a guide https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NarFg_g-kw Once in place and the slider bolts, lubricated, I torqued the attachment/slider bolts to the Scarebird bracket (I went for 35 lb-ft but I have seen reference to only 28 lb-ft). Last thing, was to add the hose to the caliper. I used a 15.5" long a Raybestos 36773 brake hose (banjo bolt end at the caliper and a normal end at the frame end - fits the OE hardline flare nut). At this point, I had problems getting the banjo bolt to seal to the caliper. That might have been my problem. I had a choice of two banjo bolts, ones that came in the Scarebird package and ones that came with the Raybestos Celebrity calipers. Not sure which ones I actually used (but they are the same left and right side). It was bear getting them to seal so I could bleed the calipers. Eventually, I won.  Topped up the master cylinder (at this point just the single pot OE style) and added the wheels (new Dorman nuts torqued to 82 lb-ft) and went for a short drive. Peddle is a bit soft at this point. Not sure why. Inadequate bleeding? OE single pot MC too small? BUT at least the brakes aren't locking up and trying to kill me.  REFERENCES: 1. Previous investigations of bracket options: http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=76959 2. Front Wheel Cylinder Games: http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=67884&... Photos to fit the text above: Edited by 56D500boy 2024-06-01 3:38 PM (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_TheStartingPoint.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_12x2point5DrumRemoved.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_CenterPlaneAssemblyRemoved.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_SettingUpToTestBracketClearance.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_NotingRemainingBracketSteeringArmInterference.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_RemainingInterferenceRemoved.jpg) (56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracket_LeftSide_AfterClearancing.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_SpindlePriorToAddingScarebirdAdapter.jpg) (DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_SpindleAfterAddingScarebirdAdapter.jpg) (RockAutoRotorsBearingsAndSeals.jpg) (RockAutoCelebrityCalipers.jpg) (56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBrackets_SomeOfTheRockAutoParts.jpg) (56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracketsEtc_LeftSide_ReadyForTheWheel.jpg) (56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracketsEtc_LeftSide.jpg) (56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracketsEtc_RightSide.jpg) Attachments ----------------  DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_TheStartingPoint.jpg (245KB - 8 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_12x2point5DrumRemoved.jpg (221KB - 7 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_CenterPlaneAssemblyRemoved.jpg (128KB - 7 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_SettingUpToTestBracketClearance.jpg (199KB - 5 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_NotingRemainingBracketSteeringArmInterference.jpg (116KB - 8 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_RemainingInterferenceRemoved.jpg (134KB - 7 downloads) 56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracket_LeftSide_AfterClearancing.jpg (249KB - 7 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_SpindlePriorToAddingScarebirdAdapter.jpg (168KB - 7 downloads) DodgeD500CenterPlaneToDiscConversion_SpindleAfterAddingScarebirdAdapter.jpg (206KB - 8 downloads) RockAutoRotorsBearingsAndSeals.jpg (79KB - 6 downloads) RockAutoCelebrityCalipers.jpg (79KB - 6 downloads) 56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBrackets_SomeOfTheRockAutoParts.jpg (106KB - 7 downloads) 56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracketsEtc_LeftSide_ReadyForTheWheel.jpg (175KB - 6 downloads) 56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracketsEtc_LeftSide.jpg (157KB - 6 downloads) 56DodgeD500WithScarebird57to61MoparFrontBracketsEtc_RightSide.jpg (157KB - 6 downloads) | ||
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| mikes2nd |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5027 | |||
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| 56D500boy |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 9956 Location: Lower Mainland BC | mikes2nd - 2024-06-01 3:50 PM its probably the OE single pot being too small.. also maybe try a "full emergency" stop to see how your front/rear balance is?... gradually build up in a parking lot to a near lock up. Good thoughts. But the OE single pot is not my end point. I can now get back to this conversion, only now with a disc/drum dual channel MC. REFERENCE: http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=75197&... | ||
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