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Expert
Posts: 1218
 
Location: Warren, Michigan | Hey all
My passenger side ball joint bangs a bit unless I grease it every time I take it out. I think its just time to replace it. The question on this is Splicer vs. Moog. They're about the same price. I've always heard Moog was awesome, so I'm leaning that way. What about splicer?
When I was looking on rock auto, I saw strut rod bushings. If I remember correctly, when I was under there they looked kind of cracked. The ones in the picture though do no look like mine. Is there a better source for bushings? I want to do control arm bushings while I'm working on it is there a source for these as well?
What are the thoughts about "MONROE SENSA-TRAC LOAD ADJUSTING SHOCK ABSORBER"? I see them listed for the rear. Is there a Monroe listing for the fronts (even with slight mods) that are of similar quality?
Any part numbers would be greatly appreciated.
'58 Chrysler Windsor 4dr Sedan
Thanks
Joe |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7423
 
Location: northern germany | Fanbladeus - 2008-02-21 9:49 PM
When I was looking on rock auto, I saw strut rod bushings. If I remember correctly, when I was under there they looked kind of cracked.
Thanks
Joe
rubber strut rod bushings suck. they always look cracked. polyurethane 4 piece B-body strut rod bushings fit our cars with some little mods (shortening) they will last forever.
KYB makes excellent gas shocks. the part # for the rear is KG5511, don't remember the part # for the front. |
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Expert
Posts: 1218
Location: Warren, Michigan | You say B-body 4-piece bushings. Were there B-bodies that did not use 4-piece bushings? I guess I'd feel more comfortable if I had a year and model to order parts from.
I checked out a late 60s road runner bushing set they look kind of close to the ones for mine. I assume I would just have to cut off that mushroomed tip off the back. I think they're about $40 for the set. Is this about right?
Is there a similar trick with the control arm bushings? I'm not sure what the standard replacement items are made out of. I like to upgrade when doing repairs to improve the quality and durability of my car.
The Monroe sensa-trac shocks have that spring over shock setup and claim load balancing for heavy cars/loads. That is why I was looking at them. Does this extra spring actually do anything beneficial or better than the KYB part listed?
I've heard good things about KYB. Maybe tonight when I have some time I'll search through the archives to find the front part numbers.
Shuld I stick with all KYB or if the monroe one is better should I mix them. I've always followed the line of thinking that components are designed to work together so you better get a matched combination.
Do these ball joints thread in? Is it one of the common ball joint socket sizes that they loan out at parts stores? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7423
Location: northern germany | the oe b body strut rod bushings are rubber of course not poly. mopar performance sells tough 4 piece strut rod bushings that fit our cars, you will never have to replace them again.
if you need more spring in the rear you can add a coil over shock kit to the kyb shocks or just get the monroes, probably cheaper. you can mix them.
yes the ball joints screw in. there is a special ball joint socket. i think there are 3 different sizes for mopars. i got mine on ebay, very cheap. you will need a 3/4 wrench and big breaker bar... remove/install ball joints BEFORE you remove the control arms.
unfortunatly there are no polyuretane control arm bushings for 57-61 full size mopars 
Edited by 1960fury 2008-02-22 9:45 AM
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Expert
Posts: 3402
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George) | Make sure whatever strut bshings you use you can draw the strut rod up the the flat/stop area, if not your caster will be negative. |
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Expert
Posts: 1812
Location: Slidell La. | I ve got to rebuild my front end also . I figure I better do it while it is down for the disc brake swap . Did I hear correctly in the past that we get a discount at Rock Auto parts ? If so how does that work ? Are all the lower bushings on Mopars the same , they all look the same . Sid , is your whole front end polyurethane ? Hows the ride quality ? I bought front shocks for 65-68 Cbody , for my 59 Ply , had to grind down the sleeve on the lower end and open up the lower bracket a bit . Worked out well .
Edited by narleycharlie 2008-02-22 4:58 PM
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Veteran
Posts: 259
Location: Detroit MI area | Editorial comment-KYB is the only shock to use on our big boats. I used to think it was hype about how good they are. Its not. My 57 Chrysler behaves the best it ever has. The KYB's replaced Monroes that only had 3K miles on them. A heckofa difference. They are expensive though, $159 a set at P-S-T.com (free shipping). Rockauto also sells them, maybe a little more with shipping.
You will have to modify the lower shock to fit the mount. It isn't a big deal at all. Also, NEVER cut the nylon straps on a KYB shock until you're ready to put them in. Let us know when and we'll walk you through it.
I got a whole front end rebuild kit for my 57 Dodge from ESPO.com. Did the work last month. 4 Ball joints, control arm bushings, outer tie rods, strut bar bushings-the whole thing. Reasonable price and all american made stuff. The package deal was better than I could do at Rockauto.
There aren't any poly bushing sets that I know of for the late 50's cars. They can also give a harsh ride. Some people like it but you'll notice a big difference just having new standard rubber stuff on the car.
Unless you have the tools, plan on paying somebody to press in the upper and lower control arm bushings. It doesn't cost that much. You also need to check the inner tie rod ends, idler arm and center link. No point doing any of this work and leaving those parts on if they're bad. The idler arm was particularly nasty on my Dodge. The bolt was half way worn through. The center links are available now, around $180 at ESPO, Kanter and couple of other places. The inner tie rods and idler arm kit are harder to find but around, I got mine at norwesternauto.com.
Last thing, the torsion bars have to come out to do the lower control arm bushings. One of my bars about fell out, the other wanted to fight. If those bars are coming off for the first time start spraying the penetration oil on the ends and bolts now!
Jim Krausmann
Detroit
Edited by JimK 2008-02-22 5:36 PM
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Expert
Posts: 1218
Location: Warren, Michigan | Wow thanks for the input. KYB looks like the way to go. I still haven't found the part number for the fronts though. Can anyone help me out with that?
I don't have a press.... is there something I could rig up and drive them in using my impact gun? I drove my idler arm bushing in this way. Otherwise where would I go to have someone press them in? I'm in the Detroit area as well, in Warren.
I already went through the tie rods and idler arm and replaced what I needed to. I'll give Espo a call to see what the price would be for a complete kit. I think when I emailed them they said they didn't have a listing for a '58 Windsor and couldn't help me with most of the items I asked about. I might do better talking to them on the phone.
I was going to ask this when I get closer to actually doing the job, but are there any tricks not covered in manual on removing the torsion bars? |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7423
Location: northern germany | Fanbladeus - 2008-02-22 6:10 PM
Wow thanks for the input. KYB looks like the way to go. I still haven't found the part number for the fronts though. Can anyone help me out with that?
?
i believe KG4507 |
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Veteran
Posts: 259
Location: Detroit MI area | Oh, your original question about Spivcer or Moog. Don't think you can go wrong with either. Spicer is no more so it must be old stock.
Espo shows a kit for a 57 NY (go to Chrysler on the home page and then look for New Yorker. For some reason its not under the 2 Chrysler listings they have on that page). They have a price for a 58 but have to call for a 57. Can't figure a Windsor is any different, nor 57/58. Do the rest of you guys know for sure? With some of the work you've done already you may not get the value from the whole kit.
A pickle fork on an air chisel makes it easy to get the ball joints out but it'll destroy the old rubber boots.
Installing the upper control arm bushings are easier but I think it'll take a press and the right size adaptors to do them. The factory service manual shows a special threaded service tool that would be hard to find. An auto parts store with a machine shop could do the work. I met a mechanic at a Chrysler dealer that did mine on the side.
The ball joints on the Dodge came out with my 1/2" impact. I borrowed the socket from another mechanic buddy. The threads feel kind of vague when installing the new joints. It would be easy to cross thread 'em and make a mess. Double check that they've started right.
Jim |
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Expert
Posts: 1218
Location: Warren, Michigan | Hmm, I'll have to see if my pickle fork will fit on my air chisel. I think the base of it is bigger than the air chisel I have.
Thanks for the number, I just ordered the KYB shocks. Just under $150 for all four with shipping. I'll hold off on the ball joints until I can talk to someone at ESPO. I wouldn't mind having some spare parts sitting around from the kit. I have a feeling that I'll own a couple more of these cars over the years.
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7423
Location: northern germany | narleycharlie - 2008-02-22 4:54 PM
. Sid , is your whole front end polyurethane ? Hows the ride quality ? I bought front shocks for 65-68 Cbody , for my 59 Ply , had to grind down the sleeve on the lower end and open up the lower bracket a bit . Worked out well .
sorry, i only have poly strut rod bushings and leaf spring poly bushings. i bought the poly leaf spring eye and shackle bushings from espo. they didn't make it ride harsher. as far as i know there are no poly control arm bushings for 57-61 fl cars. i also have poly front and rear sway bar bushings but the bars were custom made for my car and these bushings dont fit stock cars.
Edited by 1960fury 2008-02-22 9:16 PM
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Elite Veteran
Posts: 1060
Location: Building incorrect cars since 2000!! | I pressed my control arm bushings out with finding the right size pipe to do the job I believe it was some thin wall conduit work great- lub them up though!!! buy the ball joint socket makes it a easy job. |
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Expert 5K+
Posts: 7423
Location: northern germany | finally found the part# for the B body strut rod bushings. its P4529184.
http://www.monicattichrysler.com/comersus/store/comersus_viewItem.a... |
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Expert
Posts: 2490
Location: Kansas City, KS | The first time I did ball joints on a Fl'er was before the days of the wonderful internet. The local parts store got me for almost $60 for a ball joint socket. Plan a ahead and find a cheap one on eBay or at least make sure a rental is available.
ESPO has a lot of parts not listed on their website, give them a call to find out what's available. I got an entire front end kit for one of my Imperials that wasn't listed on their site (still haven't put it on though).
I have a press but still take control arm bushings up to the machine shop to get pressed in. They usually charge around $20 and that's easier than messing with it myself. I usually gather up a bunch of loose parts and have them hot tank them at the same time. |
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Expert
Posts: 1812
Location: Slidell La. | Rock Auto Parts had everything I needed for my 59 Ply . Except tie rods , anyone know where to get them ? I got all Moog cept for the lower bushings , those are Spicer . . Iused to do frontend work 10 years ago , never rebuilt an FL front . Learned something new , the lower B/Js are screw in also . Never seen that before . All the lowers I had to deal with was press in . I banged on it a few wacks till I noticed the socket hex on it . HA . Whatever you do , don t use a fork on anything your going to reuse . The part will be ruined . I decided to go with the Moog Strut rod bushings , Rock had a listing for 2 styles , long and skinny and the split type . I ve used the split type in the shop and always had luck with them . Plus they are easy enuff tho change in a few years if need be . I must say Rock was a pleasure to do business with . Ordered the parts on a Thurday and by the next Thursday I had all the parts at my door . |
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Veteran
Posts: 238
Location: Westminster, Colorado | I am currently rebuilding the front end of my 58 Coronet
And yes i found all the b-joint s and bushing @ rock auto
When it came to the shocks,again i was only finding rears from monroe 31131
After a lot of digging I found on the Gabriel web site that they have rears and fronts both in gas.
they do not match the rears are red and the front are black but a little spray and all is right in my world.
I can not find the part # off hand but I will look, I ordered them from Auto Zone , the fronts took a day to get and
the rears were in stock,
Hope this help`s good luck
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Expert
Posts: 1812
Location: Slidell La. | You better make sure those fronts match your old ones , a lot of part numbers have been recycled and now are for a diff application . i have Moroes on the back and on the front , front I bought for a 64 Ply , had to modify lower bushing . I got to say , with new shocks , I ain t impressed ,doesn t feel any diff from old ones . Guess I ll get me some KYBs when money is rite . |
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Expert
Posts: 1218
Location: Warren, Michigan | I bought the KYBs and I tell you I can't tell the difference.... of course I haven't installed them yet. They're still sitting on the shelf! I can't wait for a couple good weather days with nothing going on to tear into it. |
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Ball Joint, Bushings, Shocks Question
