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Current Miss Belvedere Progress
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   Forward Look NON-Technical Discussions -> Miss Belvedere - The Unearthed Tulsarama Plymouth!Message format
 
Jessica
Posted 2010-07-20 11:46 AM (#233418 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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They will accept a bill of sale. That is what I used for my vehicle, too. Congrats. I hadn't realized that you purchased the vehicle.

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AudioMobil
Posted 2010-07-20 1:35 PM (#233426 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Location: Germany

What car are you talking about?

 

I didn't buy Miss Belvedere...I don't know what happened to her? Is she still at Ultra One?

 

I bought a 1957 Fury at an auction on the legendary swiss junkyard in september 2009...and bought a 1957 Belvedere 4dr as

well. I guess both cars have even more rust than Miss Belvedere, I took these photos a few weeks ago...

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Jessica
Posted 2010-07-20 2:35 PM (#233436 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Ah, I assumed that since this thread is about Ms. Belvedere, that you were talking about that particular car.

What are your plans for these cars? Looks like a really involved project! I look forward to updates on your progress.
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d500neil
Posted 2010-07-20 3:11 PM (#233440 - in reply to #233436)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Trying to make Ms. Belvie JEALOUS, about your car's condition, Roland????---lololol....!




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phurious
Posted 2010-07-20 4:11 PM (#233452 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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The body tag could very well have been picked years ago, but it should be on the drivers side on the firewall. Here's mine for a reference.
All the 57's I know of were built in Detroit, and your VIN would seem to say the same. I can't be 100% sure though.

You are a brave man with no fear, ans I wish you well! Goodluck!

-Ron

Edited by phurious 2010-07-20 4:13 PM




(1957FuryBodyTag2.jpg)



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d500neil
Posted 2010-07-20 5:23 PM (#233467 - in reply to #233452)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Roland, please put your car's photos, and restoration work, on a thread, dedicated to your car, on our Member's Rides
board!

You are a brave man, indeed!

What part of Alemania do you hail-from?

We've got some 'brothers' possibly living close to you, who will be glad to give you their free-advice on
restoring your car.








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Jessica
Posted 2010-07-20 5:27 PM (#233468 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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I am also interested in which part of Germany you are located. My mother just returned from a visit there yesterday. Our family is in Wurzburg. My grandmother has just recently passed away, and she traveled there to help settle the estate and attend the memorial service. Unfortunately, I was unable to go. I haven't been back to Germany for over 10 years now.
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FURY
Posted 2010-07-20 6:33 PM (#233477 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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GREAT pictures. Thanks for sharing them! I would be very keen to see more.
Glenn.
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AudioMobil
Posted 2010-07-20 6:39 PM (#233478 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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I'm living near Ulm, which is located between Munich and Stuttgart. I posted the whole story of my cars on the International Christine Club forum. I'll start a thread over here as soon as I find some free time!

Both cars from the swiss junkyard are too far gone to be saved, but there are still useable parts left. I'd really love to restore the Fury but the body is almost broken apart, the frame is gone too. I knew they were bad but the rust is even worse than you can imagine...
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d500neil
Posted 2010-07-20 6:44 PM (#233480 - in reply to #233478)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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No, but you've got that nifty 150 (kph/mph?) speedometer, and a manual transmission set up, and maybe the
VIN tag and/or P/T plate from a real Fury, and some parts, too, in order to recreate that particular car, using
a donor car.

Is the Fury engine (block) still in the car?

Have you tried pushing the car backwards?








Edited by d500neil 2010-07-20 6:46 PM
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AudioMobil
Posted 2010-07-20 7:58 PM (#233488 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Location: Germany

I'm afraid I don't have the money to buy a 2nd car and start a restoration. Of course, if you find a straight, restoreable 2dr HT on a useable frame and if you find all the missing bits and pieces you could easily rebuild the Fury and swap the VIN#...the engine is a 318 with a 2bbl setup. I don't know if it's original, it was in the trunk when I found the car...together with a manual 3-speed transmission. Never seen a Fury with a 3-on-the-tree. The engine could be correct, maybe someone added the 2bbl setup later to get better mileage, who knows...even the manual transmission could be original. We will know when I order the build sheet...

By the way...the car doesn't have a 150mph speedo...but...



This is the only european Fury speedometer I've ever seen for real or on photos on the internet... (240kph = 150mph)

...and I have a really large collection of 57/58/59 related photos!



We tried to push it forward and backwards...it didn't move an inch! Only one wheel was moving a little.
Even the steering is stuck. Remember, this car sat in a moist wood for about 40 years...

Edited by AudioMobil 2010-07-20 8:02 PM
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big m
Posted 2010-07-20 8:30 PM (#233491 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Roland,

Scrape the area on the block just beneath the driver's side cylinder head, if it starts FP31 it is the original Fury block. If it begins with P31 it is a'57 301.

Just a "touch of rust" right?
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d500neil
Posted 2010-07-20 9:02 PM (#233496 - in reply to #233491)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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That car is so F'ing major-Kool....it's 3-speed transmission is a reason why I started that "Bullet-proof 3-Speed"
thread over on the Trannie-Board; there must be someone who can build up a vintage manual trannie
so that it can provide reliable service, with good gearing in it.

37K kilometers is only about 22k MILES; this car was parked with small-mileage on it; maybe some minor mechanical
(transmission??) snafu, and, it turns into THIS condition.....????

Maybe that's 137K....82Kmiles; that's reasonable mileage for a car to be abandoned, back then.

Roland, do you have this car's VIN plate?

BTW, pushing the car backwards seemed to help in restoring some other Plymmie, IIRC!












Edited by d500neil 2010-07-20 9:06 PM
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Jessica
Posted 2010-07-20 11:18 PM (#233517 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Ulm! Not far at all from my family. Very small world.

I really hope to see your project come along, even if it will be slowly. It already has a rich history, and will make quite the transformation portfolio! Not to mention she is one very unique lady!
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FinFury57
Posted 2010-07-21 1:29 AM (#233532 - in reply to #233517)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Great pictures, thanks!
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AudioMobil
Posted 2010-07-21 7:43 AM (#233546 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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big m - 2010-07-21 2:30 AM

Roland,

Scrape the area on the block just beneath the driver's side cylinder head, if it starts FP31 it is the original Fury block. If it begins with P31 it is a'57 301.

Just a "touch of rust" right?


John, I will check the engine number as soon as I get there next time...hopefully this weekend...

d500neil - 2010-07-21 3:02 AM

37K kilometers is only about 22k MILES; this car was parked with small-mileage on it; maybe some minor mechanical
(transmission??) snafu, and, it turns into THIS condition.....????

Maybe that's 137K....82Kmiles; that's reasonable mileage for a car to be abandoned, back then.

Roland, do you have this car's VIN plate?

BTW, pushing the car backwards seemed to help in restoring some other Plymmie, IIRC!


I would say the Fury looks more like 137k...there's some evidence the car was already botchy when it ended up in the yard. Someone added fog lights which must have been an ugly sight. There are bracket attached to the hood and it was secured with two leather straps (you still can see them wrapped around the bumper). Broken or missing seat springs were tied up with some strings, bad welding traces around the rear window. When the car was laid to rest all engine parts and most of the trim was inside the car or in the trunk...looks like someone tried to fix it but gave up and scrapped it! I guess the last owner was a younger dude. Another funny thing: Someone added an auxiliary input to the radio and wired a 2nd speaker to it. I have to try if the radio's still working...but I have my doubts...

 

Other than the Fury the 57 Belvedere I bought at the junkyard looks like an unmolested, original car that was wrecked in an accident in 1967 (when it was 10 years old). I found some newspapers dated december 1967 and the car has 67k km on the clock...

 

By the way...I already had the VIN plate before I bought the car. When I went there for the first time last summer my girlfriend found it on the ground. It fell off the door jamb because the rivets rusted away...

 

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d500neil
Posted 2010-07-21 5:42 PM (#233598 - in reply to #233546)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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You (and your car) are GOLDEN!

That VIN will allow the H.S. to provide you with your car's IBM Build card, which will tell you exactly how your car
was built.

Also, if you do not have the car's Paint/Trim data plate, someone at the Golden Fin Society can show you how the
correct P/T plate should appear, so that you can have a replacement P/T plate be custom-stamped by AG Back East,
whose contact information is shown as a Sticky-message, at the top of our Fender tag Decoding message board.





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d500neil
Posted 2010-07-21 5:48 PM (#233600 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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Your car has a 2-bbl-carb intake manifold on it.

Altho extremely unlikely, I wonder if your car could have been built with that set up, instead of with the standard
dual 4-bbl-carb set up????

Yeah, I know: it's likely that the dualies were replaced by someone who wanted to get some MPG out of the car...
but, still....?




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phurious
Posted 2010-07-21 6:29 PM (#233610 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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I may be wrong, and if so please correct me, but 1957 Plymouth Fury's from Detroit (which include all 7438 57 Fury's built) did not have Paint/Trim data plates. Only Body Number plates like the one I posted above. Although I do see the paint/trim data plates on 1958 cars from Los Angeles quite often. The information you are seeking, like Neil says, will surely be on your IBM Punch/Build Card.

I can save you some of the suspense though. Your body number will likely start out "404-_ _ _ _", your color code should be "AAA" (Sand Dune White), your body type should be "F6" and your Trim code should be "349".

All of those numbers should be the same for all 57 Fury's.
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FinFury57
Posted 2010-07-22 11:06 AM (#233723 - in reply to #233610)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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phurious - 2010-07-22 1:29 AM

I may be wrong, and if so please correct me, but 1957 Plymouth Fury's from Detroit (which include all 7438 57 Fury's built) did not have Paint/Trim data plates.


That's correct.
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lawrence
Posted 2010-07-22 4:33 PM (#233757 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Were Fury's with 240kph speedos built in Detroit?
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roope68
Posted 2010-07-31 7:34 AM (#235017 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress


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And i though my car was in a bad condition! Good luck with your car!

Edited by roope68 2010-07-31 7:35 AM
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FURY
Posted 2010-07-31 8:23 PM (#235107 - in reply to #233491)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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big m - 2010-07-21 12:30 PM

Roland,

Scrape the area on the block just beneath the driver's side cylinder head, if it starts FP31 it is the original Fury block. If it begins with P31 it is a'57 301.

Just a "touch of rust" right?


This is where you should be looking Roland. If that was a Fury engine then it will have all the Fury-only special parts inside, and not likely to be beyond restoration and quite useable. Get scraping...
Glenn.

Edited by FURY 2010-07-31 8:27 PM




(Fury-57 wreck-Switzerland-engine4.jpg)



(Engine number location-57 Fury3.jpg)



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Attachments Engine number location-57 Fury3.jpg (198KB - 431 downloads)
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Chrome58
Posted 2010-08-26 11:53 AM (#238443 - in reply to #233488)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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AudioMobil - 2010-07-21 1:58 AM

This is the only european Fury speedometer I've ever seen for real or on photos on the internet... (240kph = 150mph)

This is exactly what I was saying in this topic a few months ago (see page 5).
I have seen pictures of european Furys, and they all had the 150mph speedo.
I even held one from a french '57 Fury in my hands, and it had the 150mph speedo with golden kph numbers painted on the clear cover.

And the weird thing is that this 240kph speedo is unknown in the Mopar parts book !
It only lists the 120mph, the 150mph and the 200kph speedos ...

Truly a rare find.

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d500neil
Posted 2010-08-26 2:29 PM (#238452 - in reply to #238443)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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There are unknown P/N's for Dodge type rear antenna bases, that do not appear in my 55-58 parts book, too,
the numbers are (off the top[?] of my head) ..something like 1838481/482.

The parts exist and have DCPD numbers (according to a correspondent), but there are no such numbers shown
for them in the Good Book.

The 57-58 Dodge dualie antennae P/N's are listed in the Book; just not THESE numbers.

Boy, are WE off-thread, here....ah well, Ms. Belvie has been screwed-over, anyway...RIP, lady!







Edited by d500neil 2010-08-26 2:32 PM
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FinFury57
Posted 2010-08-26 2:49 PM (#238455 - in reply to #238452)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Btw, any news of miss Belvedere, anyone?
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phurious
Posted 2010-09-03 11:55 PM (#239648 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Miss B's on ebay? well sort of...

http://cgi.ebay.com/1957-1958-Plymouth-1-25-model-FREE-SHIPPING-NO-...

Edited by phurious 2010-09-03 11:57 PM




(!B1(sVpgCWk~$(KGrHqEOKiEE)RrH!nPRBMeRfZeHbg~~_12.jpg)



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Attachments !B1(sVpgCWk~$(KGrHqEOKiEE)RrH!nPRBMeRfZeHbg~~_12.jpg (23KB - 3236 downloads)
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d500neil
Posted 2010-09-06 8:03 PM (#239997 - in reply to #239648)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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'Hope that the modeler included the Boyd-broken driver's vent window, too.





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sconut1
Posted 2010-09-15 12:33 AM (#241487 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress


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I see the model was purchased for $20.00. I guess P.T. Barnum was right! LOL
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1955Coronado
Posted 2010-09-27 1:29 AM (#243126 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Good Lord, Roland - you ought to get all the respect & props in the world just for getting that poor beauty out in one piece.

I've seen pics of this one over the years & it always seemed like the poor thing had become one with the very earth it sat on.
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djMikulec
Posted 2010-09-29 8:39 PM (#243620 - in reply to #233491)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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big m - 2010-07-20 8:30 PM

Roland,

Scrape the area on the block just beneath the driver's side cylinder head, if it starts FP31 it is the original Fury block. If it begins with P31 it is a'57 301.



Wasn't a 318 also offered in '57 and if so, how can one tell the difference?

And to keep this on-topic... has anyone heard from Ms. Belvedere lately? Anyone know her status?

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AudioMobil
Posted 2010-09-30 6:02 AM (#243657 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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The 57 Fury standard engine was a 318, but Ron noticed that the valve covers on my engine have only 2 bolts instead of 3...so I guess it's a later 318 from 1959 or newer...

I heard nothing from Miss Belvedere during the last months, maybe she crumbled when they tried to open the doors?

Dave, how are you? Where you've been? How's Elisabeth coming along?

Edited by AudioMobil 2010-09-30 6:12 AM
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djMikulec
Posted 2010-09-30 4:06 PM (#243742 - in reply to #243657)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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AudioMobil - 2010-09-30 6:02 AM

Dave, how are you? Where you've been? How's Elisabeth coming along?

 

Doing as well as can be expected all things considered. My software job was sent to Asia last year and I was laid off in June '09. I've been looking for something else ever since but still haven't scored. Being 50 doesn't help since a lot of employers seem to be seeking younger (cheaper) talent. I work on Elizabeth whenever I get the chance... more like whenever I'm in the mood. My spirits have been awfully down lately and it's sometimes hard to get motivated in that regard.

 

It could always be worse though so I guess I should count my blessings and shut up. 

 

 

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lawrence
Posted 2010-09-30 10:18 PM (#243802 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Keep your chin up Dave, you're still breathing, still have your health. Safety Mike was down for a while too but he finally got his stuff going good again.
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Christine'sRevenge
Posted 2010-11-03 12:32 AM (#248046 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Hi Mike, really great photo"s and seems like lots of work will be needed. Just want to say goodluck and continue to help her. Thanks
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1961plymouthfury
Posted 2011-08-01 7:23 AM (#283042 - in reply to #123842)
Subject: RE: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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I agree 100% they should of put her in a room and sealed it .
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1961plymouthfury
Posted 2011-11-29 8:26 AM (#297866 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Its a shame Tulsa did not think about putting Miss Belvedere in above ground vault and locking it with seal doors. The mayor would be the only 1 to have the keys and thier would be an exhaust hose so the car could be started at least once or twice a month to prevent the motor from freezing up.
The car would be in better condition and she would be running
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safetymike77
Posted 2011-11-29 7:25 PM (#297948 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Yup... Keep your chin up... February of 2009, I lost my job. I lost my Ram, which I had at 2 years at that point that I had bought new, a whole lot of dignity, and I ended up having to move to Illinois to find work. Now, I am back up in WI, just bought a new ram and my wife a slightly used (2010) Chrysler Town and Country. Take advantage of what you can while you are down. I did bankruptcy and basically did away with all non secured (and some secured) debt. So.. when it started going well again, I was in a hell of a much better position to recover quickly.
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1961plymouthfury
Posted 2011-12-06 7:43 PM (#298848 - in reply to #297948)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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I am unemployed too . I have been job hunting I put my resume online . I have also filled out applications and printed out resumes and gave them out with my applications. I do surveys online for my income until someone calls me for a job offer
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1961plymouthfury
Posted 2011-12-11 11:20 PM (#299436 - in reply to #298848)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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I recently learned that an engineer suggest that a drain be installed in the Vault were Miss Belvedere was before she was uneartheb but they did not listen .
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big m
Posted 2011-12-12 12:35 PM (#299456 - in reply to #299436)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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1961plymouthfury - 2011-12-11 8:20 PM

I recently learned that an engineer suggest that a drain be installed in the Vault were Miss Belvedere was before she was uneartheb but they did not listen .


The water table there is fairly high, it would have required a sump pump certain times of year, most likely.

---John
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d500neil
Posted 2011-12-14 3:20 PM (#299704 - in reply to #299456)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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LOL: a sump pump WAS utilized---on WED 7/13/07.....when the lids were removed from over the vault.

The vault was well sealed, except at/along its top areas.

There was no evidence that the water that got into the vault came from anywhere other than through the non-sealed
joints along the tops and sides of the three lids that were physically placed on top of the vault.

The three lids were not even fitted with any tongue-in-groove joints; they just butted up against each other, and there
wasn't any evidence of there having been any real seam-sealer having been applied to their joints, either.




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Beltran
Posted 2011-12-19 4:47 PM (#300304 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Details... details... details.
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b5rt
Posted 2011-12-19 8:08 PM (#300324 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Still can't believe someone didn't say, "you know what... maybe this underground thing isn't a very good idea".
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AudioMobil
Posted 2011-12-19 8:45 PM (#300332 - in reply to #300324)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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Well, where's Doc Brown when you need him???

Edited by AudioMobil 2011-12-19 8:48 PM




(bttf-dmc-poster-320.jpg)



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1961plymouthfury
Posted 2012-01-12 11:26 AM (#303365 - in reply to #300324)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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That is a good question. Why didn't they say that?
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d500neil
Posted 2012-01-12 7:26 PM (#303425 - in reply to #303365)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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...Nobody cared; they'd all be dead (or nearly so) 50 years later.

"Yeah, this ought to work, just fine...."

Y'know; Ms. B. is arguably in a lot (OK: some-what) better condition than is that 57 Fury, as seen at the top of this 'page' !






Edited by d500neil 2012-01-12 7:30 PM
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catspajamas
Posted 2012-02-14 6:39 AM (#307768 - in reply to #123355)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress


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Well, Miss B is in bad shape but not as bad as some I've seen, especially for a museum piece. If you think that car is bad, you oughtta see some of the wooden boats I've seen come rotting out of the boneyards and were subsequently restored (Al Capone's was one of 'em). The crazy rascal belongs in Tulsa but since they obviously left her at the altar perhaps that car museum in Branson (I think) MO could find a place for her next to the perfectly preserved one they used for the lift tests prior to hoisting Miss B out of the hole. In any event, a few pictures of the progress - if any - would be appreciated, or at least let us know if she was scrapped - "closure", ya know. Here's a comforting thought though - that lousy vault design (no drainage, top so-called seal, no way for water to get out) is the same as that which contains most of our dearly departed relatives. Miss B fared a lot better than what I've seen come up for a forensic autopsy.
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big m
Posted 2012-02-14 12:26 PM (#307798 - in reply to #307768)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



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catspajamas - 2012-02-14 3:39 AM

Well, Miss B is in bad shape but not as bad as some I've seen, especially for a museum piece. If you think that car is bad, you oughtta see some of the wooden boats I've seen come rotting out of the boneyards and were subsequently restored (Al Capone's was one of 'em). The crazy rascal belongs in Tulsa but since they obviously left her at the altar perhaps that car museum in Branson (I think) MO could find a place for her next to the perfectly preserved one they used for the lift tests prior to hoisting Miss B out of the hole. In any event, a few pictures of the progress - if any - would be appreciated, or at least let us know if she was scrapped - "closure", ya know. Here's a comforting thought though - that lousy vault design (no drainage, top so-called seal, no way for water to get out) is the same as that which contains most of our dearly departed relatives. Miss B fared a lot better than what I've seen come up for a forensic autopsy.


Unfortunately, the museum in Branson, '57 Heaven, has auctioned all their cars off and closed the doors forever. This was several years ago.

---John
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d500neil
Posted 2012-02-15 6:50 PM (#308014 - in reply to #307798)
Subject: Re: Current Miss Belvedere Progress



Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!

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And, what a perfect un-cleaned-up exhibit Ms. Belvie would have made, there.



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