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New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-29 12:16 AM (#207085)
Subject: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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1960-1964 413 Short Ram

Exhaust Manifold Support Plates

These were used on factory 413 Short Ram equipped Chrysler 413 engines from 1960-1964. These are EXTREMELY accurate reproductions as compared to originals, not a single detail over looked, same thickness, same dimensions, holes sizes and shapes, bends, and even the original manufacturing metheod was used in producing them (notice the sheered edges, not laser cut). The spacers are precise duplicates of an original, not generic off the shelf parts, each one was machined from billit steel one at a time!

These are heavy duty thick steel plates, one end bolts to the exhaust manifold via a single bolt, the opposite end utilizes 2 attaching points to the oil pan rail and two uses special thick spacers that preserve the oil pan lip from crushing when tightened. These were used so that the extra long header shaped cast iron exhaust manifolds don't flex or move potentially breaking away at the exhaust flanges when subjected to stress. If you have an original Short Ram car, or just have a complete engine with these super cool exhaust manifolds and don't have these plates you need them.

www.harmsauto.com
509-922-9115




Edited by Scott Smith Harms 2010-01-29 12:19 AM




(Brackets B.jpg)



(Plate A.jpg)



(Plates Edge.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments Brackets B.jpg (116KB - 60 downloads)
Attachments Plate A.jpg (122KB - 68 downloads)
Attachments Plates Edge.jpg (134KB - 62 downloads)
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MOPAR-TO-YA
Posted 2010-01-29 2:38 AM (#207099 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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More info on those exhaust manifolds please. I have never seen those befor, and would be interested in them for my 64 Dodge B body. Thanks .............................MO
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B/G 61
Posted 2010-01-29 5:25 AM (#207103 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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Posts: 2613
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Hard to find, EXPENSIVE, and hard to find . . . AND EXPENSIVE
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-29 11:39 AM (#207119 - in reply to #207103)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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B/G61 pretty much nailed it. They rarely come up for sale and when they do they go for big bucks (in the several thousand range) unless you completey luck out. These only came on factory 413 Short Ram engines produced in the early 60s', the most common applications were the 63 300J's and 64 300K's.



(Short Ram Exhaust F.jpg)



(63 Intakes & Exhaust.jpg)



(Long vs Short Rams Comparison.jpg)



(Short Ram Engine.jpg)



(300JRam.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments Short Ram Exhaust F.jpg (221KB - 225 downloads)
Attachments 63 Intakes & Exhaust.jpg (209KB - 548 downloads)
Attachments Long vs Short Rams Comparison.jpg (57KB - 2620 downloads)
Attachments Short Ram Engine.jpg (218KB - 104 downloads)
Attachments 300JRam.jpg (45KB - 74 downloads)
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-29 11:51 AM (#207123 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



200050010010010010025
Location: Under the X in Texas
The intake manifold short long rams, as they are popularly known, were used on the '60-64 Chrysler 300 Letter Cars. They were optional equipment in '60-62 on the F,G, and H models. For 1963 the 300J is a standard short long ram motor. The 300K again made the short long rams an option. There are two seperate casting number pairs, one pair for the '60-62 and another for the '63-64.

The exhaust headers similarly are two different pairs of castings for '60-62 and '63-64. There is no heat provision boss on the '60-62 headers as there is on the '63-64 type shown in the photo in this thread. The 63-64 type can be found and are pricey but several hundred were built. The '60-62 type are absolute hen's teeth as only a handful of cars were so-equipped.

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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-29 11:59 AM (#207125 - in reply to #207123)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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"The '60-62 type are absolute hen's teeth as only a handful of cars were so-equipped."

I agree, I've only got one grainey B&W photo of those from an old factory press release,
I've never even seen one in person (love to get some good pics)

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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-29 12:13 PM (#207127 - in reply to #207125)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



200050010010010010025
Location: Under the X in Texas
If they weren't on my car I'd be happy to photograph them but I'm not about to disassemble the 300F Special GT for you, Scott!   Attaching an old photo taken into my driver side wheel well though!



(header.jpg)



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Attachments header.jpg (53KB - 83 downloads)
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-29 1:15 PM (#207142 - in reply to #207127)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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Was your car at the Barrett Jackson recently?
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-29 1:25 PM (#207144 - in reply to #207142)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



200050010010010010025
Location: Under the X in Texas
No, that was Larry Tarantolo's car from Illinois, the actualy car that won the Flying Mile at Daytona Speed Weeks in 1960.   My car was one of two built post-Daytona and was the only one of the Specials with factory AC and radio delete.  Other than that, mine is identical to the Tarantolo car.   You may have read elsewhere, due to damage to Mr. T's other two cars at the R&S auction, he took all three home and the F did not cross the block.
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-29 7:01 PM (#207198 - in reply to #207144)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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I heard about the carnage at Russo Steele (saw the pics, ugly!) was the "F" hurt?
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-29 8:57 PM (#207209 - in reply to #207198)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



200050010010010010025
Location: Under the X in Texas

Scott Smith Harms - 2010-01-29 6:01 PM I heard about the carnage at Russo Steele (saw the pics, ugly!) was the "F" hurt?

The F Spl had a ding in one piece of stainless side trim and was otherwise unhurt but the same owner's other two cars at this auction had significant damage.

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B/G 61
Posted 2010-01-29 9:51 PM (#207213 - in reply to #207123)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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StillOutThere - 2010-01-29 11:51 AM

The intake manifold short long rams, as they are popularly known, were used on the '60-64 Chrysler 300 Letter Cars. They were optional equipment in '60-62 on the F,G, and H models. For 1963 the 300J is a standard short long ram motor. The 300K again made the short long rams an option. There are two seperate casting number pairs, one pair for the '60-62 and another for the '63-64.

The exhaust headers similarly are two different pairs of castings for '60-62 and '63-64. There is no heat provision boss on the '60-62 headers as there is on the '63-64 type shown in the photo in this thread. The 63-64 type can be found and are pricey but several hundred were built. The '60-62 type are absolute hen's teeth as only a handful of cars were so-equipped.

What are the two casting numbers for the "short" rams made in '63-'64 ? And I have seen hen's teeth!!!        

 





(hen-teeth.jpg)



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Attachments hen-teeth.jpg (232KB - 71 downloads)
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-30 1:49 AM (#207229 - in reply to #207213)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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Mine are as follows (the grey set shown with the plate attached, blue set shown was a different set I had).

Drivers side is cast as follows:

9-12-62
E-2269093
Rev B
SCC

Passenger side cast as follows:


SCC
E-2269013-1
9-11-62





(63 Short Ram 2269093.JPG)



(Short Ram Exhaust.JPG)



Attachments
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Attachments 63 Short Ram 2269093.JPG (188KB - 91 downloads)
Attachments Short Ram Exhaust.JPG (222KB - 84 downloads)
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-30 2:20 AM (#207230 - in reply to #207229)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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These were the blue ones before paint was added, a much poorer casting AND corroded, BARELY decernable numbers but I managed to make out most of them.



Edited by Scott Smith Harms 2010-01-30 2:22 AM




(Short Ram Exhaust (1).JPG)



(Short Ram Exhaust (2).JPG)



(Short Ram Exhaust Manifolds 3.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments Short Ram Exhaust (1).JPG (207KB - 76 downloads)
Attachments Short Ram Exhaust (2).JPG (220KB - 89 downloads)
Attachments Short Ram Exhaust Manifolds 3.jpg (162KB - 78 downloads)
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B/G 61
Posted 2010-01-30 5:31 AM (#207238 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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I thought SOT meant there are two diff casting #'s for the intake manifolds (short) '60-'62/'63-'64 . . . ?
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-30 9:59 AM (#207251 - in reply to #207238)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



200050010010010010025
Location: Under the X in Texas

B/G 61 - 2010-01-30 4:31 AM I thought SOT meant there are two diff casting #'s for the intake manifolds (short) '60-'62/'63-'64 . . . ?

There would be:

A:   different casting numbers for the 60-62 headers (#2129998+99) versus the 63-64 headers

and

B:  different casting numbers for the 60-62 short rams (#2129986 +87) versus the 63-64 short rams

Sorry to have not made that more clear earlier.

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B/G 61
Posted 2010-01-30 12:20 PM (#207262 - in reply to #207251)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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StillOutThere - 2010-01-30 9:59 AM

B/G 61 - 2010-01-30 4:31 AM I thought SOT meant there are two diff casting #'s for the intake manifolds (short) '60-'62/'63-'64 . . . ?

There would be:

A:   different casting numbers for the 60-62 headers (#2129998+99) versus the 63-64 headers

and

B:  different casting numbers for the 60-62 short rams (#2129986 +87) versus the 63-64 short rams

Sorry to have not made that more clear earlier.


I did get that, I think Scott didn't - What are the '63-'64 short ram casting numbers ? By the way, ANYTIME you want to post more pics (all angles) of your car/motor feel free
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-30 2:20 PM (#207277 - in reply to #207262)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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Location: Under the X in Texas
I don't have the later numbers for either intakes or exhaust because my short ram, header car is a '60 and I don't have any of the later parts.
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-30 2:43 PM (#207280 - in reply to #207277)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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I understood you B/G 61, just posting what I had on hand, I have intake pics as well, comming right up.

Edited by Scott Smith Harms 2010-01-30 2:46 PM




(2129986.jpg)



(2129987.jpg)



(Stack Rams.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments 2129986.jpg (78KB - 64 downloads)
Attachments 2129987.jpg (133KB - 72 downloads)
Attachments Stack Rams.jpg (188KB - 83 downloads)
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-01-30 10:27 PM (#207337 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: Re: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



200050010010010010025
Location: Under the X in Texas
With Scott's addition of the '63-64 short ram pics which reveal that the casting number DID NOT CHANGE, I have to add a further note. The '60-62 short rams are STILL a different casting if only in the sense that the casting number (or part number if you will) is cast in to the BOTTOM of the arch of the manifolds for '60-62 where it is not visible and as Scott is showing us, the number is cast on TOP of the arch for '63-64 where it is in plain sight.

The only way to prove original '60-62 short rams is to reach in and feel the casting numbers on the bottom with your fingers or maybe there is an angle to get a mirror in there to see them.
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B/G 61
Posted 2010-01-30 10:54 PM (#207343 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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That was the reason for my questioning the two diff part numbers (cast) - Now I'm wondering why Ma MoPar would go through the trouble of casting the "short" rams with the part number on the underside out of sight and then changing it for only two years of production ? Does that mean they were thinking of keeping the ram tubes around longer ?

Edited by B/G 61 2010-01-30 10:57 PM
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Scott Smith Harms
Posted 2010-01-31 2:48 PM (#207440 - in reply to #207343)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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So far I've had 4 sets of Short Rams, all were the later style and had the same casting numbers, If I come accross any of the early versions I'll try to get some pics.
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B/G 61
Posted 2010-01-31 3:37 PM (#207447 - in reply to #207085)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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I have another group of questions !!! Did the "long" rams ever have the number on the under-side ? Were the "long" rams available in '62-'64 (from factory and/or the parts counter) ? Were the heat tubes the same for the exhaust manifolds and the headers ?
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pistolgrip
Posted 2010-02-06 7:12 PM (#208294 - in reply to #207447)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates


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Thanks for the education here fellas! Scott, its good to see that your getting into the ram stuff a little more. I had spoken with you a while back about this stuff. I Plan to have my '61 Plymouth wagon finished up for the summer. I'm swapping in a 413 long ram motor. Pics to follow soon.

With that said, I have a few questions for you guys. I plan on running a 65 cable shift trans with the slip yolk. Of course, that is going to be a little different than the iron case torqflite in it now. So the question is, Is the trans dipstick tube any different from the 63-64 ram cars than it is the regular 4bbl cars? I was just going to use a tube from a later car with an aluminum case trans that presses into the housing instead of bolting to the side of the pan as the early trans does. And does the 4bbl tube interfere with the rams?

Keep on passing the info fellas!

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longram60
Posted 2010-02-07 1:08 AM (#208343 - in reply to #208294)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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pistolgrip - 2010-02-06 6:12 PM

With that said, I have a few questions for you guys. I plan on running a 65 cable shift trans with the slip yolk. Of course, that is going to be a little different than the iron case torqflite in it now. So the question is, Is the trans dipstick tube any different from the 63-64 ram cars than it is the regular 4bbl cars? I was just going to use a tube from a later car with an aluminum case trans that presses into the housing instead of bolting to the side of the pan as the early trans does. And does the 4bbl tube interfere with the rams?



I run a later aluminum TF on my 60 Plymouth with long rams. The stock tube (a '63 piece in my case) works fine, no interference.
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StillOutThere
Posted 2010-02-07 10:00 AM (#208369 - in reply to #207447)
Subject: RE: New Product 413 Short Ram Exhaust Support Plates



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Location: Under the X in Texas

B/G 61 - 2010-01-31 2:37 PM I have another group of questions !!! Did the "long" rams ever have the number on the under-side ? Were the "long" rams available in '62-'64 (from factory and/or the parts counter) ? Were the heat tubes the same for the exhaust manifolds and the headers ?

No, there was only one casting of the '60-61 long rams and the numbers were on the top.

As factory equipment on the new cars, long rams were available for '60 and '61 only.  I presume factory service parts could provide them for several years thereafter over the counter but I don't know that for a fact and I'm not sure they would or did.

The '60-62 headers did not use heat tubes for carburetor heat because the carb bases at the intakes were hot water heated.   I personally am not familiar enough with the '63-64 header heat tubes to comment on those.

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