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Forward Look NON-Technical Discussions -> Miss Belvedere - The Unearthed Tulsarama Plymouth! | Message format |
1958 Plymouth Infina![]() |
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Extreme Veteran Posts: 468 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | Where is she now is she being stored away or still being restored I think she should be put behind glass in her as-is condition in Tulsa! ![]() Edited by 1958 Plymouth Infina 2012-05-29 12:41 PM | ||
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57plymouth![]() |
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Expert Posts: 3589 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Blythewood, SC | Hiding in a warehouse under Ultra-One's control being ignored. They must have realized that it will never run again and are covering their tracks. | ||
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1958 Plymouth Infina![]() |
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Extreme Veteran Posts: 468 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | They should of left the car alone. | ||
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earleebob![]() |
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Elite Veteran Posts: 1120 ![]() ![]() Location: Brisbane, Australia | Maybe send her to Turin in Italy for Raffe, The Patron Saint of Holy Chryslers to resurrect!!!!!! ![]() ![]() | ||
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lawrence![]() |
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![]() Expert Posts: 3951 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Bama | http://www.autosavant.com/2012/02/23/what-happened-to-the-1957-plym... | ||
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lawrence![]() |
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![]() Expert Posts: 3951 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Bama | The artifact should be done like this on a bigger scale..
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60 dart![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Passed away 30th Sept 2024. You will be missed Chuck! Posts: 8954 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: WHEELING,WV.>>>HOME OF WWVA | what historical or other value does it have ? 0 ! send it to the crusher and ship it with the rest of the scrap to china !----------------------------------------later | ||
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rbmain![]() |
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | Bury it with Boyd Coddington. | ||
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Beltran![]() |
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Expert Posts: 1730 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Michigan | I'm with Chuck on this one. Crush it. It is a testament to a monumental failure. It will never look good. It doesn't represent Tulsa, Plymouth, or Forward Look vehicles in a positive light. It will cost a significant amount of money to just maintain it so it doesn't collapse. They can't even get inside the car for fear of opening the doors? Strip what good you can from it and crush it. | ||
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dukeboy![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6203 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Big pimpin' | Funny, only person here who even thought of reserecting one as bad as Miss Belvy would have to be John at Big M. Let's hear it John? Wanna have at this one? | ||
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lawrence![]() |
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![]() Expert Posts: 3951 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Bama | I'll never forget that Mayor's face. She was sobbing like a baby. Then the people's family who built the vault, they ducked out when they learned it had failed. The car should be cast in a huge acrylic block. A whole city back in '57 knew about that car. Then in 2007 a lot of the whole world knew about it. The Titanic was a bigger failure than the Tulsa Belvedere's vault construction. How will that Prowler be in Tulsa when they crack it's vault?? One more thing, when they put gas and oil down in the vault with the 57 Belvedere in Tulsa, a lot of people had to have known that crap wouldn't last!! People had already been driving for 50 yrs by 1957. A few fortunate people anyways. Maybe the gas had stabilizer in it?? | ||
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hemidenis![]() |
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Expert Posts: 3905 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Northen Virginia | give it to the Smithsonian institution. | ||
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Lancer Mike![]() |
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: The Centennial State | If it is still under warranty, they should really send it back to Chrysler. I think it is a lemon. | ||
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big m![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 7827 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Williams California | dukeboy - 2013-03-04 9:29 AM Funny, only person here who even thought of reserecting one as bad as Miss Belvy would have to be John at Big M. Let's hear it John? Wanna have at this one? I would never attempt this, Chaney, as EVERYTHING made of steel is shot or badly compromised. After it was removed from the vault and before Ultra-One did their cleaning, it would have made an interesting artifact if put inside an hermetically sealed glass or plexiglass box for viewing. Now it is just a memory, although there is probably a couple thousand dollars of good parts for someone else's restoration project. ---John | ||
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rbmain![]() |
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | The dumbest idiot in the World couldn't have produced a worse result with this car on purpose. What were these people thinking when they buried it? | ||
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d500neil![]() |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: bishop, ca | The Prowler is being stored above ground. It wasn't that the vault, itself, was defective, it's just that the 3 separate lids over it were not sealed to each other and/or to the sides of the vault. Not even tongue-and-groove joinery to them; butt-joints and physically lying on top of the perimeter walls. | ||
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PlymouthFury![]() |
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Expert Posts: 1324 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Hickory, NC | It is a shame the car was ruined due to some idiot engineers...why the vault was not properly sealed? Was it just to save money...and hoping no one would ever care to dig the car back up or what? But the fact that it was done is still a pretty neat thing. And the fact that they chose a Plymouth to put in a time capsule...even cooler. Just think...it could have easily been a '57 bowtie in there instead. Of course then the car could have been fully restored using a catalog... The car should be preserved somehow and made viewable. But it seems Tulsa doesn't care and neither do the car's owners. Is the car just sitting in the back of Ultra One's warehouse or what? There haven't been much in terms of updates...thats for sure. | ||
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dukeboy![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6203 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Big pimpin' | PlymouthFury - 2013-03-07 10:32 PM It is a shame the car was ruined due to some idiot engineers...why the vault was not properly sealed? Was it just to save money...and hoping no one would ever care to dig the car back up or what? One look at some newer cars with all this BULLSH*T attached to them like NAV systems, Wi-Fi or whatever, 20 Onboard computers in order to run the vehicle as lean as possible, on the verge of melting a piston in order to achieve that 35 MPG everybody can't live without today, etc. and you'll understand full and well where these types of engineers thinking comes from. To me? Burying it in a Bathtub makes perfect sense as I understand over-educated idiots masquerading as "Engineers"... Edited by dukeboy 2013-03-08 7:56 AM | ||
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Doctor DeSoto![]() |
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Parts Unknown | Many types of higher education tend to school the common sense out of the student. When my law classes started to ramp up into teaching the dismissal of right and wrong as opposed to shades of grey, it was time for me to go. I work with engineers all the time and they seem to fall into two types - those that still retain common sense, and those who stim on all that whiz-bang data and calculation to defy the obvious. Amusingly, this type of personality also seems to be unable to interface in relationships well as part of the deal. You know, ... "Ten minutes to Wapner, definitely." ![]() | ||
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1961plymouthfury![]() |
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Expert Posts: 2654 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Minor Hill, TN | Its a shame no one put the car in above ground vault | ||
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Swept57![]() |
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Expert Posts: 1622 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Seville, OH | You guys are implying that some MIT PhD designed the vault. I got the impression that it was the local cement guy. This was clearly a case of low-bid, under-qualified contractor, probably the mayor's uncle. | ||
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MOPAR-TO-YA![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5140 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | Swept57 - 2013-03-24 7:26 AM Or maybe the only one that would do it for free?................................MOYou guys are implying that some MIT PhD designed the vault. I got the impression that it was the local cement guy. This was clearly a case of low-bid, under-qualified contractor, probably the mayor's uncle. | ||
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dukeboy![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6203 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Big pimpin' | Swept57 - 2013-03-24 8:26 AM You guys are implying that some MIT PhD designed the vault. I got the impression that it was the local cement guy. This was clearly a case of low-bid, under-qualified contractor, probably the mayor's uncle. And you are implying it wasn't some MIT PHD with too many Folks telling him "His" design was "too much money" and they "got-a-guy" that'll do it for half price. Either way, it was a stunt and nothing more. Everybody has a basement and I haven't seen ONE that didn't leak at some point. Especially, if there's a highway next to it. Wonder if they teach that at MIT? Edited by dukeboy 2013-03-25 12:28 PM | ||
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Rebels-59![]() |
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK | Remember it was 1957 , so not the technology / knowledge there is in 2013, also wasn't this Cement a New Process idea.?? | ||
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MOPAR-TO-YA![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5140 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | Rebels-59 Coronet - 2013-03-25 11:43 AM Yes Clive, part of it was. IIRC there was a guy who had come up with a "spray concrete" ideah. I don't remember if he built the vault, or used the spray concrete to seal it . I can imagine that he provided his services as a great advertisement for what he did. No doubt a process that had not been tested for 50 years. My bet is, a lot of houses were built with concrete blocks which would leak water and so he would coat the outside of them with his spray concrete'that was near the unveiling, The guy that had the spray concrete was still alive and he and his family were just leaving the resturant. He was in a wheelchair. I bet he was disappointed with the outcome of Miss Belvie. ................... MORemember it was 1957 , so not the technology / knowledge there is in 2013, also wasn't this Cement a New Process idea.?? | ||
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dukeboy![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 6203 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Big pimpin' | Rebels-59 Coronet - 2013-03-25 12:43 PM Remember it was 1957 , so not the technology / knowledge there is in 2013 They had above ground vaults in banks in 1957 didn't they? Edited by dukeboy 2013-03-27 6:36 PM | ||
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Swept57![]() |
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Expert Posts: 1622 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Seville, OH | d500neil - 2013-03-07 2:49 PM It wasn't that the vault, itself, was defective, it's just that the 3 separate lids over it were not sealed to each other and/or to the sides of the vault. I thought it was a one piece lid that they sawed into three pieces to remove. | ||
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lawrence![]() |
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![]() Expert Posts: 3951 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Bama | I still say I saw at least 100 rust rings in the tank. I say the water rose and fell with the water table and seeped right through the porous concrete walls. In and out.
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MOPAR-TO-YA![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5140 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | Larry, You are right. I saw all those water level rings too, and that means water was entering AND exiting. thru the sides and bottom--not just the top alone.................................MO | ||
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60 dart![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Passed away 30th Sept 2024. You will be missed Chuck! Posts: 8954 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: WHEELING,WV.>>>HOME OF WWVA | musta been designed by city engineers . the concrete isn't the problem . the technology of concrete has been around for about 2500 yrs or more . believe me when i tell ya the concrete of 1957 was by far superior to todays in longevity . todays crete uses chemicals , differently for every need and classification . ------------------------------later | ||
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chrysler300c![]() |
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Expert ,, George Passed away July 28th 2021, He will be Missed Posts: 1295 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Twin Falls, Idaho | This vault is what they called Gunite back in the 50's and it is what they used to build swimming pools and then they would put a thin coat of white plaster over it to finish the pool. It is very porous. This vault only sit a foot or so below the ground surface and it had a sprinkler system on the grass above it, as I recall. Also, it rains extremely heavy in OK during summer thunderstorms... it was inevitable that water would seek its way into the vault and I am sure that is why they put the car in a plastic bag back in 57. I would think the water ebbed and flowed up and down in the vault time after time with the result that the bag was torn at the rear of the tailfins... probably from the movement up and down on the tailfin. It was doomed from day one! George | ||
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rogerh![]() |
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Extreme Veteran Posts: 455 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: seattle, Wa. | When did this car get married? Or is she still a Miss? | ||
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ronbo97![]() |
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Expert Posts: 4133 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Connecticut | The vault flooded as a result of a water main break that occurred in the late 70s. One of the workers that helped repair the break remarked, "There goes that old car". Another person that assisted in the unearthing stated, "Had that not have happened, I really think what the people did 50 years ago would have worked." (from Auto Restorer magazine, August 2007) | ||
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MOPAR-TO-YA![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5140 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | ronbo97 - 2013-05-09 10:48 PM As said earlier, water came in and came out many times. Evidenced by the multiple water mark rings. Most likely as a result of different ground water levels through the years..........................MOThe vault flooded as a result of a water main break that occurred in the late 70s. One of the workers that helped repair the break remarked, "There goes that old car". Another person that assisted in the unearthing stated, "Had that not have happened, I really think what the people did 50 years ago would have worked." (from Auto Restorer magazine, August 2007) | ||
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Doobster![]() |
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Member Posts: 47 ![]() Location: England. | Why on earth didn't they see it coming? Where I live in England, you'll need to take the ground water level into account if you want to build a small goldfish pond in your back garden (yard)
There's no excuse.
Houses all over the world and in the US have had basements for centuries!
Edited by Doobster 2013-05-10 8:19 PM | ||
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wbower3![]() |
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Walter passed away on Jul 29, 2014. We will miss you, Walt! Posts: 5358 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Heaven Above (Formerly Oklahoma City,OK) | Since this dog has died, why are people still trying to beat it to death? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? | ||
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56royaldodge![]() |
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Account deactivated by owner's request ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: On this barrel | A dead dog doesn't feel pain. | ||
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rbmain![]() |
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![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | That dog won't hunt. | ||
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60 dart![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Passed away 30th Sept 2024. You will be missed Chuck! Posts: 8954 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: WHEELING,WV.>>>HOME OF WWVA | they should take it back to tulsa and bury it from which it came ! -------------------------------------------------------------------------later | ||
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wbower3![]() |
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Walter passed away on Jul 29, 2014. We will miss you, Walt! Posts: 5358 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Heaven Above (Formerly Oklahoma City,OK) | 60 dart - 2013-06-13 12:39 AM they should take it back to tulsa and bury it from which it came ! Agreed ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ||
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lawrence![]() |
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![]() Expert Posts: 3951 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Bama | |||
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Mopar1![]() |
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Expert Posts: 3085 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: N.W. Fla. | "Rusting away in Margaritaville" If it had been a Chevy it would be less of a tradgedy. | ||
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d500neil![]() |
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Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil! Posts: 19146 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: bishop, ca | In Larry's photo, above, notice how uniformly wet the entire ground strata is, above the vault. Ms. Belvie was not (necessarily) destroyed by any one event, including the flooding of the Arkansas River (I forget when: look it up...), but, rather by the ingenuous design to lay three lids, physically, on top of the vault, without any real sealing or tongue-in-groove installation of the lids to the vault and/or to its walls. Those of us who were there don't regret the pilgrimage to Tulsa; only the net-result. BTW, the Sheriffs deputy, seen in Larry's photo, was one of the nicest Lawn Enforcement Types that you'd ever hope to meet (in this country). | ||
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lawrence![]() |
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![]() Expert Posts: 3951 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Bama | The 3 fat deputies standing on the lids weren't very nice. I tried to stand on the corner of the lids beside them on the spectator side of the caution tape the first time. If you'll notice, they are still staring at me from the other side of the septic tank. | ||
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57plybel![]() |
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Extreme Veteran Posts: 594 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Melbourne, Australia | Nett result of pal Marty pokin' 'round the hole too much !!!
Colin | ||
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Christine'sRevenge![]() |
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Extreme Veteran Posts: 424 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Harrison, NY | Can someone tell me where the car actually is, who the owner is, etc? Thank you. | ||
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57plymouth![]() |
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Expert Posts: 3589 ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: Blythewood, SC | It's still being stored at Ultra One. Those two ladies that won it sent it there, and it's been sitting ever since. | ||
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Rebels-59![]() |
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Board Moderator & Exner Expert 10K+ ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: .Norfolk..Mafia.. ,England UK | I heard one of the sisters passed away, Even so they will never see that car in their lifetime.. I wonder what condition it is in being stored in Ultra Ones unit all these years , And if it is still in one piece | ||
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MOPAR-TO-YA![]() |
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Expert 5K+ Posts: 5140 ![]() ![]() ![]() Location: cornpatch county, Southwest IOA | Rebels-59 Coronet - 2013-07-12 11:57 AM I bet a dollar to a donut that there is a money issue involved and someone is pi**ed off. I heard one of the sisters passed away, Even so they will never see that car in their lifetime.. I wonder what condition it is in being stored in Ultra Ones unit all these years , And if it is still in one piece If anyone knows it's current status, I would say it is Steve Hobby. He is excommunicated here, but he has another early Mopar forum and at one time had the inside info from Ultra -One | ||
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