|
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
   
Location: bishop, ca | It was announced today that J.P. Morgan will be funding an Initial Public Offering on "Chrysler" stock.
No anticipated stock pricing was announced, but it is anticipated that $6-Billion of stock will be floated
to the buying public.
Chrysler's re-emergence to being a publicly traded company is a complete turn-around from their Corp
Honchos having agreed to be acquired ( A "Merger of Equals"--HAH) by the owner of Merciless Bends, in 1998.
Too bad that Deadler-Chrysler killed off the Plymouth; Bill Watson likes to defend Deadler's action, but
in 1998, Plymouth had the products available to become the Green/Family/Entry-level model series,
with Dodge becoming the Performance Division, and with Chrysler becoming the Luxury Division.
These three Divisions would serve separate markets, with each one having its own target-buyers
and each model would be separate and unique appearing; not just "re-badged" cars.
But, Deadler had/has no clue about establishing a brand-loyalty, since they cherry-pick the richest
demographics for their customers.
Plymouth was poised to compete with the JappoKorean economy boxes, which market Deadler completely
foresook.
Today, Fiat (our corporate masters) has begun to market the Fiat 500 and the Dodge Dart in this country
to try to re-establish some entry-level brand-loyalty vehicles.
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-23 5:42 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1730
 
Location: Michigan | Neil, they took those brands off the market yes, but if Fiat / Chrysler wanted to start up the Plymouth brand again they certainly could.
No disrespect but I was there in Auburn Hills at the time. The marketing guys running the brands were complete idiots. They kept making things more and more complicated for the factories, driving costs up instead of down and that was the choice of local management. There was lots of blame to go around. I am not trying to defend Daimler, but lets be clear here, management was screwed up on both sides and the train wrecks were everywhere. There were so many people fired before the split and after the split (once Daimler was out) it was clear the old boys club was shaken to the core. Eaton left quite a legacy ....
They still own those brands. The company is better off for the trimming down of the excess. Let's hope that someday things get real good again and they bring back those brands. I would love to see it happen. I miss working for Chrysler... a lot.
Edited by Beltran 2013-09-23 9:01 PM
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | Do you know if they're still planning to kill off Dodge? They certainly poised themselves to, renamed the trucks "ram." The only reason I have no idea if they are is that they brought back the viper. They could however, just slap a chrysler nameplate on it much like they did on the prowler when they deleted plymouth from the line. |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | The "Ram" was Fiat's effort to create another product Division.
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2519
Location: central Illinois | Where is this idea of killing off Dodge coming from??? I've heard nor read of any such thing other than on this forum. It's funny, I bought a '12 Ram and two guys I work with have purchased similar trucks and everyone, including these two co workers refers to them as Dodge trucks.
As far as Viper, it's now badged as SRT. Same for the other high end performance models offered by Chrysler Corp.
Getting back to the killing off of Plymouth, IIRC the only models offered the last 2 years of existence were the Prowler, Neon and Voyager (was that the minivan name?) The doubling up of nearly identical models was redundant. There were many badging decisions made in the 90's that made little sense with the Eagle brand taking the lead on the list. If resources wouldn't have been wasted reinventing the wheel and the Eagle models would have been Plymouths, things may be different today. |
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | A few years ago (probably 4 or so) I read that Fiat was planning to position the company to eliminate the dodge brand if it needed to. Shortly after I read that suddenly the viper is gone and the trucks were now "ram." No longer Dodge branded, you won't find it anywhere. It made perfect sense. |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | The "products" were doubled up, but it was a no-brainer to separate the several completely different models that were being
built, in 1998, among the three car-series.
In my non-published letter to the WPC News, in protest to the take-over, I pointed out that that Chrysler had developed a 4x4
platform (as seen at Carrol Shelby's skunk works, way-back in the WPC 1987 national meet), that would work wonderfully in
the Plymouth Cirrus platform, and that a STATION WAGON 4x4 (AWD) Cirrus would have been the only competition for the yuppie
Stupidbaru wagon.
Back in 1998, Chrysler had plenty of cars that were stand-alone models.
I, even, suggested that the 6-banger engine be installed in the Cirrus, and to call it the RoadRunner.
It woulda kicked ass.
In 1998, Chrysler had a mini car (pre-EVERYBODY) called the Expresso; I wrote that that should have been built;
it would have been a mega-seller.
The current "Dodge Dart" series could be a "Plymouth", as an entry-level product(s).
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-23 9:50 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1730
Location: Michigan | Believe me Neil, there were lots of us that saw all kinds of opportunities right in front of us that were powerless to make them happen or even get someone's ear about the ideas. For a decade before the Hemi's came back we were all saying, 'why don't we produce the hemi again! Ford and GM are bringing back the muscle, are we going to be late to the party here too?' sure enough... we lost 3-4 years of big gains in this area. Ford and GM went unanswered from Dodge. Fortunately, we produced a much nicer looking car with a much better retro look than the others. Better late than never.
It was like going to work and knowing your potential but not being able to realize it. It was a very depressing time to work at Chrysler. |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | The 1985 WPC national meet, in Detroit was fantastic, though; a great celebration of the return of Chrysler to profitability,
with the K cars' introduction, in 1984.
The club arranged for Plant Tours, and Iaccoca's daughters accompanied us on one assembly plant tour (riding around in those
carnival-type-ride pulled-cars).
In 87, we-all toured Shelby's SoCal Skunk works; again, fantastic experimental cars (4x4 Daytona, etcetcertc..) and souped-up engines/parts lying around the place.
He even had a mini 2-car gymkhana race track set up, complete with Chrondek christmas tree.
Too bad that Shelby, toward his last few years, appeared to disavow any of his Chrysler/Iaccoca relationships.
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-24 1:41 AM
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | "Too bad that Shelby, toward his last few years, appeared to disavow any of his Chrysler/Iaccoca relationships."
No actually he didn't. He was VERY insistent that the dodges be INCLUDED in the Shelby Auto Club against quite a lot of the ford guys wishes. Up until as recently as 2006 Shelby drove his number 1 '89 CSX to sema in vegas. Allegedly that was his personal favorite and the most technologically advanced next to the 16 valve turbo cars. They even added and brought out many of his number 1 Dodges into the museum for display in recent years. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1493
Location: Jamaica Plain, MA | Dodge still has a lot of products in the fleet. Challenger, Avenger, Dart, Charger, Durango, Journey and Grand Caravan. The sporty versions being special edition SRTs, which don't appear to say Dodge on them except maybe on the tail light. |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Well, that's 'good', but what happened with 'Shel, after 2006?
I've kept abreast of his public appearances and news reports, but haven't seen anything about his big, significant, former relationship with Chrysler.
I well recall his promotion of the OMNI GLHS, which absolutely smoked a GT350 in magazine comparison testing.
Shelby drove the Viper Indy pace car in 1991 and attended the Viper introduction private meeting with 101 of we "Viper Prospects" there (OK, I'm proud/bragging; semi-guests of Dodge, at the race; we were wined-and dined and got preferential seating at the race)...along with Bob Gale, Marty Levine and Roy Sjoberg---who really developed the Viper.
Shelby was the spiritual inspiration (and the public figurehead) for the Viper----and he has autographed a lot of glove boxes---but he was not really closely involved in its creation or production.
What's my point?
He was very involved with Chrysler in the 80's and 90's, but he sure disappeared from MoPar view, in the 00's.
I don't recall seeing/hearing anything from him, in Re: MoPar, in the 00's.
Maybe it's a 2-way street, and the MoPar Shelbyists have been remiss in not promoting THEIR involvement with him.
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-24 3:45 PM
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | Shelby's relationship with chrysler lasted to 2000. In '95 he released a small batch of "Shelby" vipers and in '99 he did a small batch of SP-360 Durangos. After '06-07 he began a new relationship with ford selling stuff he's been making for junkstangs for YEARS through ford. Would you expect him talking much about his time with Chrysler at that point, I wouldn't not when they were using him to sell ford.
 (rsz_s-dur.jpg)
Attachments
----------------
 rsz_s-dur.jpg (221KB - 114 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | "He was very involved with Chrysler in the 80's and 90's, but he sure disappeared from MoPar view, in the 00's.
I don't recall seeing/hearing anything from him, in Re: MoPar, in the 00's."
Neil that group is SUCH a small number of folks.. remember Shelby only built a very small run of actual Shelby Dodge vehicles in numbers as low as 500 and no greater than 1000. That's a pretty narrow niche crowd to me.. |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Apropos of nothing FWDLK, but EVERYTHING Chrysler, here are SOME photos of the WPC Club's 1987 visitation to the
Shelby/Dodge Skunk Works, in SoCal.
"Funny", but in 1987, a lot of club members were 'afraid' to go to the Burbank National Meet ("freeway-traffic")
...BOY, did they miss out on a great time.
Among other delights, you'll see the 4x4 Daytona, and a lot of experimental engine configurations.
That small car being assembled, is the Dodge Shadow GLHS.
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-24 4:18 PM
 (PICT2725.JPG)
 (PICT2726.JPG)
 (PICT2727.JPG)
 (PICT2728.JPG)
 (PICT2729.JPG)
 (PICT2730.JPG)
 (PICT2731.JPG)
 (PICT2732.JPG)
 (PICT2733.JPG)
 (PICT2734.JPG)
 (PICT2735.JPG)
 (PICT2736.JPG)
 (PICT2737.JPG)
 (PICT2738.JPG)
 (PICT2739.JPG)
 (PICT2740.JPG)
 (PICT2741.JPG)
 (PICT2742.JPG)
 (PICT2743.JPG)
 (PICT2744.JPG)
 (PICT2745.JPG)
 (PICT2746.JPG)
 (PICT2747.JPG)
 (PICT2748.JPG)
 (PICT2748A.JPG)
 (PICT2750.JPG)
 (PICT2751.JPG)
 (PICT2752.JPG)
 (PICT2753.JPG)
Attachments
----------------
PICT2725.JPG (93KB - 160 downloads)
PICT2726.JPG (91KB - 118 downloads)
PICT2727.JPG (90KB - 107 downloads)
PICT2728.JPG (98KB - 108 downloads)
PICT2729.JPG (99KB - 115 downloads)
PICT2730.JPG (102KB - 112 downloads)
PICT2731.JPG (98KB - 115 downloads)
PICT2732.JPG (58KB - 118 downloads)
PICT2733.JPG (105KB - 119 downloads)
PICT2734.JPG (106KB - 107 downloads)
PICT2735.JPG (109KB - 113 downloads)
PICT2736.JPG (104KB - 115 downloads)
PICT2737.JPG (101KB - 105 downloads)
PICT2738.JPG (102KB - 119 downloads)
PICT2739.JPG (108KB - 121 downloads)
PICT2740.JPG (61KB - 111 downloads)
PICT2741.JPG (99KB - 112 downloads)
PICT2742.JPG (103KB - 110 downloads)
PICT2743.JPG (106KB - 105 downloads)
PICT2744.JPG (55KB - 111 downloads)
PICT2745.JPG (110KB - 107 downloads)
PICT2746.JPG (60KB - 114 downloads)
PICT2747.JPG (60KB - 125 downloads)
PICT2748.JPG (61KB - 111 downloads)
PICT2748A.JPG (58KB - 106 downloads)
PICT2750.JPG (103KB - 107 downloads)
PICT2751.JPG (61KB - 110 downloads)
PICT2752.JPG (97KB - 110 downloads)
PICT2753.JPG (97KB - 140 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Location: Parts Unknown | d500neil - 2013-09-25 12:25 PM
I well recall his promotion of the OMNI GLHS, which absolutely smoked a GT350 in magazine comparison testing.
Maybe it's a 2-way street, and the MoPar Shelbyists have been remiss in not promoting THEIR involvement with him.
===========================================================
The jones I see for people getting misty over the Mopar era Shelby cars is that the Cobras
and Mustangs of the sixties were just that, cars of the Golden Era.
As kick-ass as some features might be, a rubber bumper car with seat belt buzzers pulls up
a nostalgia of Madonna, Cory Hart, or Poison, not the Beach Boys, Beatles, or Led Zeppelin.
The 50's and 60's were heady times in terms of youthful longing and nostalgia. The 80's ?
Gimme a break ! Little but bad times, bad music, sucky cars, and nothing to get too excited
about. 
Even if a GHLS smoked a GT350, the 350 will smoke any Toyota lookalike 80's mobile for points
on any nostalgia trip. That's just reality. The 60's were happenin' times. The 80's were pretty
much non-contenders. Unless, of course, you own the collector's edition of Dirty Dancing. 
|
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | The 80's WERE kick-ass times; a long way removed from the family-oriented/gas-crunched cars of the 70's.
Not a bad economic decade, at all.
For Chrysler, the good times began in 1984.
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-24 4:22 PM
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | I knew that was coming.... LOL BTW Neil I took the liberty of sharing this thread with those who will certainly appreciate the photos you posted. I hope you don't mind.
Edited by Finsinthemirror 2013-09-24 4:22 PM
|
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | ...Not at all; tell 'em I gots more of them.
In that one photo, where the member is holding the rocker-cover, it says: "Chrysler by DeTomaso".
I may be wrong--it's only been a couple years ago, but isn't that a V/6 engine being dyno'ed, above?
The Lotus-engine, seen in pic 2750 is installed in the white car seen in pic 2739.
Edited by d500neil 2013-09-24 4:39 PM
|
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca |
I'll PM 18 more photos to 'Fins', but here's a couple that are not redundant---the cars in the parking lot are awaiting
shipment.
 (PICT2754.JPG)
 (PICT2755.JPG)
Attachments
----------------
PICT2754.JPG (108KB - 105 downloads)
PICT2755.JPG (109KB - 95 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | I may be wrong--it's only been a couple years ago, but isn't that a V/6 engine being dyno'ed, above?
It looks like it, I know he did work with the 318 too. I'm second guessing myself a little because there is a WHOLE lot in many of those photos I've never seen..
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | In that one photo, where the member is holding the rocker-cover, it says: "Chrysler by DeTomaso".
I think it's maserati |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Nope....put a magnifying lens on the photograph, and it does 'say' : "By DeTomaso"...that's why I made a point of
mentioning that factoid.
|
|
| |
|
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1116
Location: CA | You're right, that 16v stuff is way ahead of its time. |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1730
Location: Michigan | See all those red Shelby lancers. I had number 711 for 10 years. It was our family car and the first Chrysler I bought. I paid 10.500 dollars for it. It was a test car that had a little fender bender and they couldn't sell it as new. My wife loved that car and I was sorry to have to sell it.
I also worked on the Maserati project. I ran the database that the plant used to keep track of all the parts they needed and the superseded reference list for everything the car needed. It was my second job at Chrysler and I was a team of 1, reporting to this guy named Werner Trippen.
Crap I don't even know why I remember that. Haven't said that name in 20 years. He was an old German guy that spoke Italian (he was involved in the War...but would never talk to me about it) and he worked with the plant to sort out the issues with the Maserati TC. I was his programmer, assistant, engineering data analyst. Fun job. Got to feel like you really made a difference because we really improved the quality of the cars once we sorted out all the engineering change data.
He told me that the plant guys started carrying around my parts list printed out because it was the only thing they could trust. Our work helped to bring the car program back on schedule and greatly improved the build quality.
Sorry for the diatribe.. but you all sparked some old neurons and brought a grin to my face.  |
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 1730
Location: Michigan | Thanks for bringin back a good memory Neil. |
|
| |
|
New User
Posts: 3
| Thank you d500neil. I'm a Shelby Dodge enthusiast and the current caretaker of 1987 GLHS 0075 and 1987 Lancer 176. I registered on this forum just so that I could post here and let you know how much it meant to me to see these pictures. There is incredible history there and these are some of the most interesting photos I've ever seen. I will be pooring over them with a magnafying glass for years to come. Again, thank you for taking the time to scan and share these memories with us. It means a lot to me.
Out of curiosity, do you remember what date your tour would have been?
Scheduled shipping date for my Lancer was March 9, 1987 and January 7, 1987 for my GLHS.
Edited by glhs0075 2013-09-27 6:49 PM
|
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Stephen, the tour was a part of the WPC Club's 1987 national meet, which would have occurred in late July, of 1987.
I probably have literature and/or the club magazine for that meet.
I do recall that we were not given any Goodie bags or other memorabilia during that visitation.
There were no Lancer Pacificas on the premises.
The Shadows' production may have recently started, because there were few of them stored outside the premises.
The docents/guides were very friendly patient and informative.
|
|
| |
|
Location: Parts Unknown | Where can I get a cool mustache like that guy in the red shirt ? 
Edited by Doctor DeSoto 2013-09-28 2:54 PM
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 2312
Location: Arizona | You need to fire up your Hot Tub Time Machine to get one. |
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca | Glad you specified which 'stache you like.
No law against trying to grow your own.
 (Staches.JPG)
Attachments
----------------
Staches.JPG (106KB - 89 downloads)
|
|
| |
|
Location: Parts Unknown | Right now I'm running with the Gunny-approved stache. The creepy 80's guy stache would
earn a guy extra duty and keep the ladies away for sure. 
|
|
| |
|
Expert
Posts: 3155
Location: NY & VT | Great pics Neil!
Far as 'staches go, no-one beats "Lawrence" from office space for total 'stache cool.
Edited by firedome 2013-09-30 11:31 AM
|
|
| |
|
Location: Parts Unknown | What would YOU do if you had a million dollars ????
|
|
| |
|
Exner Expert 19,174 posts. Neil passed away 18 Sep 2015. You will be missed, Neil!
Posts: 19146
Location: bishop, ca |
..Speaking of De Tomaso's relationship with Dodge, above....found this:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-DE-TOMASO-DODGE-ORIGINAL-2-PAGE-AD-DeT...
|
|
| |
Chrysler's pending I.P.O.
