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Transmission noise
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jboymechanic
Posted 2018-04-22 12:26 AM (#562050)
Subject: Transmission noise



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Location: Muskego, WI
I recently removed my TorqueFlite transmission in my 1956 Imperial in order to replace the torque converter. I had mistakenly installed a 1957 TC with 172 teeth when I put the drivetrain back together and into the car. The result was a horrible sound and the ring gear being chewed up every time the car was started. I did the job by the book; I built a wooden cradle to support the engine, I installed two guide studs on the right side of the bell housing and I even purchased a transmission jack so I could tilt the transmission as needed during removal and install. Removal was uneventful, everything pulled apart as expected.

When I reinstalled the transmission after the correct 146 tooth TC was in place, I slid the front pump drive sleeve into the transmission and lined up the drive tangs into the front pump. I checked that it was fully seated an that I could feel the pump turning by hand. I then lined up the TC side tangs of the drive sleeve to the recesses in the TC and slid the transmission into place along the guide studs and slightly tilting the trans on the jack to make sure everything was parallel. I was able to push the transmission up flush against the bell housing, but the trans jack would rock back and leave a roughly 0.050 gap between the trans and bell housing. My garage floor is sloped for drainage and the force to push the trans against the bell housing was not excessive. I figured I was good and bolted everything up.

I have finally finished the job, including all the small details such as installing and adjusting the control cable, neutral safety switch wire, kick down linkage and so on. There were many other things that I did while under the car, one key item was that I installed an external transmission fluid filter and cooler using braided stainless steel -06 AN hose (that's 3/8 inch). I filled the trans with 7 quarts of ATF as specified in my factory service (1 quart was already in the TC) manual and started the car. The starter noise was definitely fixed, but now something seemed noisy in the transmission, right up front near the TC and front pump. As the car ran, I was able to add and additional 3 quarts of fluid, which was surprising, for a total of 11 quarts (the cooler is small, about 1 square foot, and the filter is the same size as the oil filter for the car). As I added the fluid and shifted the car into gear the noise quieted down, but it was still there. It wasn't an awful noise, it reminded me of noisy valve train of one of my old high mileage Subarus, but it was definitely different sounding than prior to my work.

So what I'm getting at is... did I screw up the front pump drive or am I being overly sensitive? Sorry for the long story and detail, but I thought knowing the full story would be most helpful. Let me know your thoughts and thanks for taking the time to read.

Pictures below are from disassembly. Note how bad the 172 tooth ring gear is! When I pulled the trans, the front pump drive sleeve stayed in the TC, that is not how I reassembled.

Edited by jboymechanic 2018-04-22 12:31 AM




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Attachments thumb_IMG_2711_1024.jpg (190KB - 14 downloads)
Attachments thumb_IMG_2708_1024.jpg (193KB - 13 downloads)
Attachments thumb_IMG_2709_1024.jpg (215KB - 18 downloads)
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wizard
Posted 2018-04-22 2:31 AM (#562053 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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Normally, the pump drive sleeve should be inserted into the pump first, this since there is a steel ring in that end that might break if inserted askew. The TC end has an O-ring which is more forgiving.
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jboymechanic
Posted 2018-04-22 7:50 AM (#562061 - in reply to #562053)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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Yes, Wizard, that is how I installed the drive sleeve. The picture with the drive sleeve in the TC is from disassembly. Maybe I'll start and run the car and take a video.
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wizard
Posted 2018-04-22 8:35 AM (#562063 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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Was the sleeve work in the drive tabs? Try to take a video with the sound.....
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jboymechanic
Posted 2018-04-22 11:32 PM (#562092 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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What did you mean to type when you said "was the sleeve work in the drive tabs"? Still no video, but I did play with my old TC and a parts torqueflite I have in the garage. I don't think I could have messed up, if I didn't have the drive sleeve drive tangs in the slots on both ends the gap between the trans and the bell housing would have been like 1/4" or more, not the tiny gap I had. Maybe the pump is a little noisy given there is greater pressure drop since I added the filter and cooler?
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wizard
Posted 2018-04-23 12:48 AM (#562101 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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Keyboard error Jon; was the drive sleeve tangs worn? Sometimes they can be rather hacked up.
The filter and cooler shouldn't be the reason.
I'm thinking perhaps the regulator spring could create some sounds, or as you say the front pump
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jboymechanic
Posted 2018-04-23 11:22 PM (#562164 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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No wear on the drive sleeve tangs, drive sleeve was in good shape all around. There was no noticeable noise in the transmission prior to changing the TC, any chance the TC is just a little noisy?
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wizard
Posted 2018-04-24 12:45 AM (#562168 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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Yes, the TC might be worn, pay attention if the sound gets worse and keep a close eye for metal fragments in the oil.
We have a transmission workshop here in Sweden that opens the TC and renovates them - you should have this service over there too.
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jboymechanic
Posted 2018-04-24 10:50 PM (#562238 - in reply to #562168)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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Here is a link to a video. After being away from the car for a few days and starting it tonight I think it's fine. I think I was just nervous after completing a big job on the car. See what you think

https://youtu.be/V6xEpYYMdpo
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wizard
Posted 2018-04-25 1:27 AM (#562242 - in reply to #562050)
Subject: Re: Transmission noise



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I hear nothing alarming Jon, perhaps it was, the regulator spring that made the noise due to cold boiling (pump cavitating due to air in the fluid)
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