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No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318
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Myke
Posted 2021-02-25 9:26 PM (#609259)
Subject: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Hey all, So I posted a while back about how I had a knock on a fresh rebuild '58 318, pulled it back apart to realize i forgot to have the rods reconditioned which was causing a knock. before I pulled it back out it was running 50 psi oil pressure. I recently reassembled it and restarted it, Let it run for 60 seconds but didn't get any oil pressure so I killed it, it had a very low knock for about 20 seconds that then went away, checked the heads and wasn't getting oil to them, but the filter was full. So I'm stuck on if I should bother trying to spin the pump manually with a drill, or take a chance and see if its just slow to pump up. The filter being full of oil should be sign that the pump is at least functioning, correct?
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58coupe
Posted 2021-02-26 12:00 PM (#609279 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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You should manually spin the pump till you have oil pressure at the fitting on the top rear of the block where the oil pressure gauge connects. I believe the early 318 is like the hemis and others and feeds oil to the rockers through the cam bearings only part of the time, so you won't get oil to the rockers unless the engine is turning over.
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Powerflite
Posted 2021-02-26 12:34 PM (#609280 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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I agree. Definitely figure it out with the drill before you start running it again. You can also crank the motor with the starter while running the drill to see if you can get oil to the top if you like, but the big issue is to get oil pressure on your gauge. It could be a bad gauge connection, but you definitely need to figure it out before running it again.

Edited by Powerflite 2021-02-26 12:35 PM
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mikes2nd
Posted 2021-02-26 12:57 PM (#609285 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318


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a minute on no oil pressure? you should shut it off immediately after 10 seconds.

Put an oil gauge on the block and spin it. Go get a cheap spin on gauge.
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Myke
Posted 2021-02-26 1:42 PM (#609292 - in reply to #609280)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Powerflite - 2021-02-26 9:34 AM

I agree. Definitely figure it out with the drill before you start running it again. You can also crank the motor with the starter while running the drill to see if you can get oil to the top if you like, but the big issue is to get oil pressure on your gauge. It could be a bad gauge connection, but you definitely need to figure it out before running it again.


Sounds like a plan, I have an Extra intermediate gear I can grind the teeth off of, though it's unlikely it's a bad connection as it's a manual pressure gage w a steel braided line. Thanks!
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Myke
Posted 2021-02-26 1:43 PM (#609293 - in reply to #609285)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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mikes2nd - 2021-02-26 9:57 AM

a minute on no oil pressure? you should shut it off immediately after 10 seconds.

Put an oil gauge on the block and spin it. Go get a cheap spin on gauge.


Thankfully I used Exorbitant amounts of moly assembly lube and most of that time was waiting to see oil come up to the rockers
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56D500boy
Posted 2021-02-26 3:33 PM (#609303 - in reply to #609279)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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58coupe - 2021-02-26 9:00 AM
You should manually spin the pump till you have oil pressure at the fitting on the top rear of the block where the oil pressure gauge connects. I believe the early 318 is like the hemis and others and feeds oil to the rockers through the cam bearings only part of the time, so you won't get oil to the rockers unless the engine is turning over.


This has come up before:

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=73763&...

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Myke
Posted 2021-02-26 9:06 PM (#609309 - in reply to #609279)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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58coupe - 2021-02-26 9:00 AM

You should manually spin the pump till you have oil pressure at the fitting on the top rear of the block where the oil pressure gauge connects. I believe the early 318 is like the hemis and others and feeds oil to the rockers through the cam bearings only part of the time, so you won't get oil to the rockers unless the engine is turning over.

So I constructed a rod with a notch in it using the old oil pump for reference, and used a drill while cranking with the plugs out. STILL no pressure to the gauge or rockers, spun it for about 30 seconds. I know it was spining the pump bc i could hear it knocking a little. Really hoping i dont have tio pull this thing out a 3rd time. Should I try spining it longer?


Edited by Myke 2021-02-26 9:08 PM
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Powerflite
Posted 2021-02-26 9:14 PM (#609310 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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If the oil pump is actually working, you should feel that the drill works relatively effortlessly at first, and then it should struggle to continue turning once the oil is being pumped. It takes alot of power to pump the oil and you can physically feel that transition with the drill. Did you feel the drill kick back and slow down once the oil started pumping? If not, then you have a problem with your pump/pickup/drive and will likely need to pull the pan.
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Myke
Posted 2021-02-26 9:31 PM (#609312 - in reply to #609310)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Powerflite - 2021-02-26 6:14 PM

If the oil pump is actually working, you should feel that the drill works relatively effortlessly at first, and then it should struggle to continue turning once the oil is being pumped. It takes a lot of power to pump the oil and you can physically feel that transition with the drill. Did you feel the drill kick back and slow down once the oil started pumping? If not, then you have a problem with your pump/pickup/drive and will likely need to pull the pan.


No I definitely didn't feel it struggle at all, I did Notice an oil leak coming from the back of the block above the rear of the pan, so I guess it has to come out again.
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Stroller
Posted 2021-02-27 10:51 AM (#609328 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318


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Maybe a bit off but one place I've seen more than once forgotten. There is plug inside the block in the lifter oil galley that somehow gets spaced out going back together. Inside from the plug on the back of the block.
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-02-27 5:30 PM (#609335 - in reply to #609328)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Stroller - 2021-02-27 9:51 AM

Maybe a bit off but one place I've seen more than once forgotten. There is plug inside the block in the lifter oil galley that somehow gets spaced out going back together. Inside from the plug on the back of the block.
Not sure about the "A" Poly, but happens on the Hemi & hemi based Polys. Standard trick is to drill a .050 hole in it to lube the cam/Int shaft gears.
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-02-27 5:32 PM (#609336 - in reply to #609280)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Powerflite - 2021-02-26 11:34 AM

I agree. Definitely figure it out with the drill before you start running it again. You can also crank the motor with the starter while running the drill .
run the drill while a buddy slowly turns it over with a breaking bar/ratchet.

Edited by Mopar1 2021-02-27 5:32 PM
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Myke
Posted 2021-02-28 11:13 PM (#609374 - in reply to #609336)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Mopar1 - 2021-02-27 2:32 PM

Powerflite - 2021-02-26 11:34 AM

I agree. Definitely figure it out with the drill before you start running it again. You can also crank the motor with the starter while running the drill .
run the drill while a buddy slowly turns it over with a breaking bar/ratchet.

Should It be done Slowly to work better? I tried it with a buddy cranking it with the plugs out.
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Myke
Posted 2021-02-28 11:14 PM (#609375 - in reply to #609328)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Stroller - 2021-02-27 7:51 AM

Maybe a bit off but one place I've seen more than once forgotten. There is plug inside the block in the lifter oil galley that somehow gets spaced out going back together. Inside from the plug on the back of the block.


Im not sure the one youre reffering to, does anyone else know bout this?

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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-01 6:57 AM (#609389 - in reply to #609374)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Myke - 2021-02-28 10:13 PM

Mopar1 - 2021-02-27 2:32 PM

Powerflite - 2021-02-26 11:34 AM

I agree. Definitely figure it out with the drill before you start running it again. You can also crank the motor with the starter while running the drill .
run the drill while a buddy slowly turns it over with a breaking bar/ratchet.

Should It be done Slowly to work better? I tried it with a buddy cranking it with the plugs out.
I'm familiar with Hemis. They oil 1 bank of rockers at 1 point in the rotation, the other at a different point. If you turn it slowly you can tell when you get to each point. Then pause....
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-01 7:00 AM (#609390 - in reply to #609375)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Myke - 2021-02-28 10:14 PM

Stroller - 2021-02-27 7:51 AM

Maybe a bit off but one place I've seen more than once forgotten. There is plug inside the block in the lifter oil galley that somehow gets spaced out going back together. Inside from the plug on the back of the block.


Im not sure the one youre reffering to, does anyone else know bout this?

Same beginning as above. On Hemis there's a plug in the back of the block that lines up with the dizzy. Behind the dizzy is the actual oil galley plug, that's how you gain access to it to clean it out. Sometimes the shop forgets to put it back in & no/litttle oil pressure. Take a look.
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-01 7:02 AM (#609391 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Pull the dizzy & look with a small mirror. The galley runs fore and aft.
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58coupe
Posted 2021-03-01 12:11 PM (#609394 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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I haven't torn down an early 318 but have done more than one LA 318-360 and there is no plug you are referring to like the hemis. These blocks are very similar early and late, so not sure it has a missing plug. Could it be a problem with the bypass valve?
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-01 12:21 PM (#609395 - in reply to #609394)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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58coupe - 2021-03-01 11:11 AM

I haven't torn down an early 318 but have done more than one LA 318-360 and there is no plug you are referring to like the hemis. These blocks are very similar early and late, so not sure it has a missing plug. Could it be a problem with the bypass valve?
could be.
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Myke
Posted 2021-03-01 4:22 PM (#609400 - in reply to #609394)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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58coupe - 2021-03-01 9:11 AM

Could it be a problem with the bypass valve?


Is there a way to check this bypass valve with the engine in the car? To add as Well, I converted this to a spin on filter, but looking in the search right now, it seems like you have to block off this bypass valve, which I didnt do. Would that cause no oil pressure?



Edited by Myke 2021-03-01 4:37 PM
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-02 7:00 AM (#609415 - in reply to #609400)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Myke - 2021-03-01 3:22 PM

58coupe - 2021-03-01 9:11 AM

Could it be a problem with the bypass valve?


Is there a way to check this bypass valve with the engine in the car? To add as Well, I converted this to a spin on filter, but looking in the search right now, it seems like you have to block off this bypass valve, which I didnt do. Would that cause no oil pressure?

The Tex Smith hemi book shows them tapping the passage to install a screw in plug. On the hemis there's a spring loaded anti-drain back ball that keeps oil in the OEM filter. While some small amount of oil can get around the ball it's not enough to be a bypass of a clogged filter. So it doesn't absolutely have to be changed, probably same in the 318.
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-02 7:02 AM (#609416 - in reply to #609259)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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you'd have to drop the pan & the Main cap....
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Myke
Posted 2021-03-03 8:32 PM (#609466 - in reply to #609416)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Mopar1 - 2021-03-02 4:02 AM

you'd have to drop the pan & the Main cap....


Finally found the problem, pulled the engine, dropped the pan and found that i didnt torque the oil pump bolts down enough and the bolt had worked themselves out by a half inch. Mystery solved
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Myke
Posted 2021-03-03 8:32 PM (#609467 - in reply to #609416)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Mopar1 - 2021-03-02 4:02 AM

you'd have to drop the pan & the Main cap....


Finally found the problem, pulled the engine, dropped the pan and found that i didnt torque the oil pump bolts down enough and the bolt had worked themselves out by a half inch. Mystery solved
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Mopar1
Posted 2021-03-04 6:39 AM (#609475 - in reply to #609467)
Subject: Re: No Oil Pressure Fresh Build 318



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Myke - 2021-03-03 7:32 PM

Mopar1 - 2021-03-02 4:02 AM

you'd have to drop the pan & the Main cap....


Finally found the problem, pulled the engine, dropped the pan and found that i didnt torque the oil pump bolts down enough and the bolt had worked themselves out by a half inch. Mystery solved
that would do it!
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