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Being an 11 year employee of Oregon DMV,
I think I can provide some insight into various issues brought up by this
thread.
First, a disclaimer. Naturally
each state, province, and country has it's own unique ways of processing vehicle
ownership. In dealing with classic, and sometimes quite expensive cars,
you should familiarize yourself with the process of obtaining title in your
state before making a purchase! And buying from Canada is always
interesting, to say it nicely. Not only do you have to have the Canadian
registration, but of course you would have to clear customs,
too.
I currently have a car listed for sale
on ebay ('59 Savoy), and have clearly stated that I have a clear title. I
would be willing to email a copy of that title to any potential buyer during the
auction. Any ebay seller unwilling to do this, I would be extremely wary
of bidding on that item.
snip "you will
never see the title because the dealership is required by law to process the
change of ownership". This is not
necessarily true. In Oregon, dealers are allowed by law to charge each
customer up to $50 to process the paperwork to obtain title. If you buy a
car for cash (no lien) from an Oregon dealer (even a brand new car), you have
the right to refuse to pay the $50 to the dealer, demand the paperwork, which
the dealer must provide to you within 30 days, and then you can transfer it
yourself. If you don't mind waiting in line, that is!
snip "For
vehicles purchased without a title (on a "bill of sale"), there are companies
that can obtain a good title for you at a cost." It has been my experience that if a person LEGALLY
obtains a car, these services are not needed and can actually hinder your
ability to obtain title, or at least make it more confusing, time consuming and
expensive. If you have a problem with a title, first off you will have
much more success if you don't walk into a DMV with a chip on your shoulder,
like so many people do. The DMV stereotype is not always true, although I
can't say that's the case always. I try not to make it true in my
office. If you can use some tact, often times you will find the
sympathetic ear which will lead you step by step through any difficult
transaction.
snip "As for it
being a violation of the "Privacy Act", any public record is not subject to any
privacy act." Not true, and you should know
your laws before jumping to any conclusion. Again, in Oregon, several
years ago our own version of the Privacy Law went into effect. If you have
a situation with a lost Oregon title and don't know who the previous title
holder is, there is a way to obtain that information, but you can't just walk up
to the counter and demand to be given the names. Unfortunately, due to the
way people treat each other, i.e. stalking, harassing, etc, there have been some
protections built in to each person's "private" information: name, DOB,
address, DL#, etc. It may be a bit cumbersome to go through this
particular process, but it helps to protect title holders. .
.
Naturally, I'm more familiar with the
way Oregon DMV does business than other states, but if you have a problem
getting title on a car, I can try to help. . .send me an email. If you're
not from Oregon, though, you'll probably get better information from someone in
your own state, but don't depend on the hearsay of friends, neighbors,
etc. Get the facts, and know what you're doing before getting in over your
head. . .
Have a great car show season
everyone!
Mark mjh
'57 Fury, '57 Savoy, '68 300 convert in
sunny S Oregon. . .
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 9:23 PM
Subject: [FWDLK] Fw: IML: Checking
ownership
----- Original Message -----
From:
ROGER MEISENBACH
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 2:48
PM
Subject: Re: IML: Checking
ownership
BUYER'S BEWARE............Word of caution to anyone contemplating
buying a car out of Canada. They do have a process called Registration
there, similar to our titles, providing for valid/certified transfer of
ownership. Just know that any Canadian joker/shyster can legally sell
any vehicle with a simple Bill of Sale and the agreeable VIN, WITHOUT
BEING THE CURRENT REGISTERED OWNER!!!
Believe this is true in all the
provinces. Some transactions, especially at Used Car Dealerships, may
go through multiple "sales" without Registration/Title change and the
last registered owner being maybe years back in the car's history. And
unobtainable for sign-off. I understand the locals live through this
by obtaining some kind of easy-to-get temporary license tag that does not
require proof of ownership. Sound absurd? You bet.
I speak from first-hand negative experience in
an eBay deal where policy states rather quick deposit and final payoff
(also, the eBay buyer protection plan, Safe Harbor, does not apply to deals
outside the U.S.). My "seller" delayed sending a copy of the current
Registration/Title long enough to clear my Cashier's Check and then never
provided it. It was non-existent and he knew
it. But perfectly legal in Calgary, Alberta, Canada.
Without proper paperwork showing a
valid transfer, you cannot get a car across U.S. customs...whether it was
U.S. or Canadian built. There's more to this story but this is enough
for now. Anybody else with crooked Canadian deals? Who would
think that any civilized system in the Western World would allow such a loop
hole and opportunity for "legal" criminal misrepresentation. I can
only guess this system prevails because it provides attorneys a cash cow.
Roger K.C., MO
----- Original Message -----
From:
Bob Smith
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2003 11:07
AM
To:
mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: IML: Checking
ownership
When buying a used car, you will already need to have the title in
order to register it, so you know who that person is. As a rule,
private party sales require the current owner (or seller) to sign off
on the title and give it to you. Finding owners previous to the last
one I think was the issue.
In addition, if you buy from a car dealership you will never see the
title because the dealership is required by law to process the change of
ownership.
For vehicles purchased without a title (on a "bill of sale"), there
are companies that can obtain a good title for you at a cost but again,
you will not know who the last (or any previous) owners were.
As for it being a violation of the "Privacy Act", any public record
is not subject to any privacy act.
Regards,
Bob
"A. Foster" <monkeypuzzle1@xxxxxxx>
wrote:
No
Sir;
Finding former owners is pretty standard practice in
jurisdictions that
require titles for vehicle registration. If you
buy a used car you need the
last registered registered owner to
transfer the title to you. In the case
of a car that hasn't seen the
road for some time it is no uncommon for the
owner of a car not to
have the title transfered to him unless he intended to
drive it
straight away.. How would you go about doing that without a
title
search of prior owners if you are not allowed to know who those
owners are?
I think someone is getting car ownership mixed up with
license plate
numbers.
Best Regards
Arran Foster
1954
Imperial Newport
Needing A Left Side tailight Bezel and other trim
parts.
----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent:
Thursday, June 19, 2003 6:32 PM
Subject: Re: IML: Checking
ownership
> I highly doubt that any state will give anyone
information about a car's
former owner for the simple fact that it is
a violation of the Privacy Act.
> Doug 1958 Crown coupe
>
>
> > From: Bob Smith
> >
Date: 2003/06/19 Thu PM 08:24:09 EDT
> > To:
mailing-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: IML: Checking
ownership
> >
> > If you know what state it was last
in, some states might furnish this
information (for a fee). In some
cases, they charge for each owner
information. However, in
California, no one can get information on former
owners due to a law
that was enacted about a decade ago. If you don't know
what state it
was last registered in, you are pretty much out of luck.
>
>
> > JOHN FACER wrote:
> >
Hi,can anyone tell me how to trace the the previous American owners
of
my 1981 Imperial.?
> > Any help would be welcom.
>
> Johnny 'Jack Daniels' Facer
> >
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