Re: 727 Leaking Fluid like it was made in Great Britain

[Joe <brinkjr@xxxxxxxxx>]

Jason,   Please elaborate on what you mean by rowel pin drifting?
Wrong size dowel Pin reinstalled?   Someone filled and redrilled?
the reason I'm asking is to know what to look for as I rebuild my 318

On Sep 8, 7:24 am, Jason Rhoades <Ja...@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> O boy does this sound familiar!     Friends and family were certain i had a zipper under my car we counted like 50 in/outs trying to figure that exact same thing exactly the way u describe.  I finally took an empty trans case and dial indicated the centerline of the crank against center of trans.  Low and behold a dowl pin had drifted in in the block allowing the trans to shift out of alignment you are allowd 7 thou of miss allignment and the seal is supposed to seal it but without the dowls to hold it. Every time rhe thing would leak even tried a couple different trannys same thing.  Then i fixed the dowl and as yiu say beat on the car merciloisly till the 410 gears surrendered boy they heard them a county block away when they steped out.  O well.  Next project. Jason
>
> Sent from my Motorola ATRIX™ 4G on AT&T
>
>
>
> -----Original message-----
> From: John Hammond <426_maxwe...@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: "1962to1965mopars@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <1962to1965mopars@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thu, Sep 8, 2011 05:57:32 GMT+00:00
> Subject: 727 Leaking Fluid like it was made in Great Britain
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: 426_maxwe...@xxxxxxxxxxx
> To: "The 1962 to 1965 Mopar Mail List Clubhouse"
>
> <1962to1965mopars@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 11:37 PM
> Subject: Torqueflite Flood
>
> This one seems to have everyone stumped and the ordeal so far will make for
> a long explanation: so please bear with me, and ANY imput or past
> experiences relayed will be most appreciated. My '64 330 wagon has a mild
> 440 backed by a Full Manual Valve-Bodied 727. Both engine and transmission
> are fresh rebuilds from respected shops and have less than 200 miles on
> them. Since the 440 is so new, I've been really conservative in driving
> style and nothing has seen the high side of 3800rpm yet. Coming home from a
> cruise-in a scant 7 miles from my home a few weeks back everything is as
> fine as it has been since it's first miles driven. Later that evening the
> wife and I decide to go for a bite to eat and drive the wagon to the
> restarant. Coming off of a long hill in third at about 50mph something lets
> go and pumps most all of the trans-fluid out of the 727 and oils down the
> exhaust so bad I thought it was an electrical fire under the dash: car was
> so full of smoke it was hard to see out. I get it on the side of the road
> and by the time I had the fire extinguisher in hand, the tons of smoke had
> dissipated and a wave of trans fluid ran out from underneath the car.
> Quickly looking underneath the STREAM of fluid was coming from the
> inspection cover slightly to the passenger side from center. Car went home
> on a rollback since I hoped it was something like a pump and likely the
> internals might be OK. The flood was nice and red and had no burnt scent
> from it. I should mention that the wagon has a huge plate style cooler,
> (probabaly a quart cap.), and a 1-qt. extra capacity pan along with a new
> (10-1/2" ?), mild upgraded convertor.
> The transmission shop pulled the 727 out, removed the convertor and
> pump - which appeared fine with no signs of damage or failure, replaced the
> usual, expected seals, reinstalled everything and started the car which
> instantly began pouring out fluid again. Looking behind the convertor with
> an inspection mirror while still installed - it appeared as if the convertor
> drive snout wasn't engaging the seal in the pump and thereby allowing a
> massive leak. Out comes the 727 and the convertor was replaced with a new
> stock-type convertor along with all of the previous mentioned seals again
> just in case something was pinched or misaligned on the first attempt. Upon
> restarting; no leaking is apparant. Testing it in every gear by stalling it
> against the brakes after the fluid was up to operating temp no leaks. Car is
> deemed fixed and I drove it five miles home. I drove it home slowly in the
> rain because of bad wipers but nothing seemed less than ok. Following day I
> decided to take a short spin for a better assessment, started it, let it run
> for 4 or 5 minutes, no leaks, no smells or smoke, and I started down the
> road. In less than 1 mile it has started pumping out the fluid again. Turned
> around, parked it, check the dipstick which still shows some fluid at the
> very end of the stick and I started making calls.
> The drive hub or snout of the convertor shows to have perfect wear
> pattern at 200 miles without any galling or scratches. If the bushing in the
> front pump was bad, the evidence would show up here in that reguard due to
> slop allowing less than concentric alignment. So we can probably rule out,
> convertor, pump, and seals at this point. The dipstick is from Lokar, I
> called their tech department and verified that the scale is consistantly
> calibrated prior to manufacture to an original 727 tube and stick as factory
> installed. They stated it was so, and assured me that if seated against the
> case the indicated area will yield a correct level reading. The FSM calls
> for 7-9 quarts on a stock panned 727. Adding a qt. for the deep pan, a qt.
> for the huge cooler, that would bring the total up to around 11 qts. Almost
> exactly the amount used to produce the correct level shown on the verified
> Lokar dipstick. Hensley Racing when posed with this problem suggests that
> the transmission is simply overfilled and the excess is being spit out of
> the vent on the forward top portion of the front pump. I agree that the
> vent is likely the source of the leak at this time especially considering
> the location of the stream of the leak compaired to the location of the vent
> hole. What doesn't make sense is why the car made 200 miles prior to the
> problem with that amount of fluid and now that the leak has started; nothing
> seems to stop it at the same given quantity of fluid installed and level
> checked. One other question I've yet to get an answer to is "Venting from
> where?" Is this hole in the pump justl ike a hole for a breather in a valve
> cover, or is it plumbed/part of, to a specific passage or circuit?
> I contacted Turbo-Action tech dept. and told them what I'd been going
> through and asked if this could be a valve-body related issue. They said it
> was possible, but unlikely. I've used the full-manual reverse-pattern
> Cheetah body in a number of cars, without any problems, ever, for decades.
> The tech stated that the regulator valve may have stuck allowing pressure to
> go unchecked in the high gear servo which would force the fluid out the path
> of least resistance ( i.e. the vent or the dipstick tube). The Lokar stick
> is seated pretty firmly in the tube I might add. The repair entails removal
> of the valve body, removal of the regulator from the body, polish with emory
> cloth until smooth activation and release is obtained and reinstall. He
> again states that this condition is very rare to occur, however. I surmise
> that since it has obviously happened at some time, and since right now, it
> is the most logical explanation of the condition I'm experiencing it's the
> best guess so far.....but wow it seems really far-fetched. I'm attempting
> to contact Pat Blais to see if he has any ideas on this as well, but I've
> yet to speak with him. Maybe someone here has some info as to what is
> happening and how to address it; or somebody else I should talk to? In all
> my years of Mopardom I've never seen or heard of anything like this and
> neither had Hensley Racing. I am by no means a transmission guy but one
> doesn't need to be with a 727. You simply install it, fill it, and beat on
> it unmercifully till the end of time without worry unless you install a
> transbrake and/or slicks.... at which point you check on it, occassionally.
> Again, if anybody can shed some light on this, I would be most thankful for
> your aid... just the transfluid and the bags of oil-dry are approaching my
> fuel costs......thanks, John Hammond
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "The 1962 to 1965 Mopar Mail List Clubhouse" group.
> To post to this group, send email to 1962to1965mopars@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
> 1962to1965mopars+unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/1962to1965mopars?hl=en.
>
> --
> --
> Please address private mail -- mail of interest to only one person -- directly to that person. That is, send parts/car transactions and negotiations as well as other personal messages only to the intended recipient, not to the Clubhouse public address. This practice will protect your privacy, reduce the total volume of mail and fine tune the content signal to Mopar topic. Thanks!
>
> 1962 to 1965 Mopar Clubhouse Discussion Guidelines:http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.org/mletiq.htmlandhttp://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/general_disclaimer.html.
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The 1962 to 1965 Mopar Mail List Clubhouse" group.http://groups.google.com/group/1962to1965mopars?hl=en.

-- 
--
Please address private mail -- mail of interest to only one person -- directly to that person. That is, send parts/car transactions and negotiations as well as other personal messages only to the intended recipient, not to the Clubhouse public address. This practice will protect your privacy, reduce the total volume of mail and fine tune the content signal to Mopar topic.  Thanks!

1962 to 1965 Mopar Clubhouse Discussion Guidelines:
http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.org/mletiq.html and http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/general_disclaimer.html.
-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The 1962 to 1965 Mopar Mail List Clubhouse" group.
http://groups.google.com/group/1962to1965mopars?hl=en.