The Forward Look Network
The Forward Look Network
Search | Statistics | User Listing Forums | Chat | eBay | Calendars | Albums | Skins | Language
You are logged in as a guest. ( logon | register )

Hemi fuel pumps
Jump to page : 1
Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page]
View previous thread :: View next thread
   Forward Look Technical Discussions -> Engine, Exhaust, Fuel and IgnitionMessage format
 
GregCon
Posted 2013-08-16 8:14 PM (#391678)
Subject: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 2472
20001001001001002525
Location: Houston


My fuel pump was leaking oil and gas so I suspected it was time to give it some attention.

I did some searching on this site and found this thread:

http://www.forwardlook.net/forums/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=46680&...

It mentions the Airtex 4280 as a works-but-not-correct pump but doesn't say what the differences are.

I ordered a 4280 from Rock Auto. The pump I had, which was on the car when I bought it, is an Airtex 4609AX. I know this because it is stamped as such and the box it came in was in the trunk along with an even older, used 4609AX.

You can see from the pics that the 4280 is much smaller in diameter. I assume this means it has a lower capacity but who knows?

Another oddity is the 4609AX (both of them) have a notch cut into the body to allow them to clear the block. It seems odd ....

When I had the engine out, I was aware of this clearance issue and ground the block enough to clear the pump without any notch in the pump body.

What really gets me is the 4280 has the screwy reversed in/out ports, so the rear port is the outlet. I used to see cars with the reversed pump (always aftermarket) and I loathed them. On my car, this of course looks screwy and required me to make up a new fuel line. I'm going to live with it until I get a 4609AX rebuilt.

The 4280 does seem to work well, at least at normal driving flow conditions.


So.....

1) Does a stock pump have a notch in the body?

2) Does anyone know what engine the 4280 is actually meant for?


















(354 fuel pumps.jpg)



(4609AX fuel pump1.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments 354 fuel pumps.jpg (100KB - 75 downloads)
Attachments 4609AX fuel pump1.jpg (94KB - 76 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
StillOutThere
Posted 2013-08-16 8:38 PM (#391682 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



20001000
Location: Under the X in Texas
Of course without knowing the year and displacement of your motor, we can't begin to answer this.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Shep
Posted 2013-08-16 9:24 PM (#391697 - in reply to #391682)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 3129
2000100010025
Location: Chestertown, NY ( near Lake George)
I have the 4280 on my 55, just had to re-clock the fuel inlet position.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Mopar1
Posted 2013-08-16 10:29 PM (#391710 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 2736
200050010010025
Location: N.W. Fla.
To finish my comment I started on the other Thread...there been a number of hemi F/Ps that have been crapping out lately or having other problems. I solved mine by buying an adaptor from HH & used the LA F/P.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
wayfarer
Posted 2013-08-17 12:49 PM (#391822 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Elite Veteran

Posts: 804
500100100100
Location: Central Ory-Gun
I have seen numerous examples of the 4280 with varying styles of actuator arms which may or may not allow them to properly work in an EarlyHemi type application. Recently I had occasion to check the NAPA supply for this exact pump and their cross-reference showed the pump application as a 49-54 6cyl...
For anyone attempting to use any AirTex 4280 I recommend drawing an outline of the actuator arms and comparing the new to the old to see if they are even close. Same can be done with the A-LA pump by shifting it over a bit...if the arm, at some point, overlays the original then you can make a spacer.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
GregCon
Posted 2013-08-17 1:38 PM (#391835 - in reply to #391822)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 2472
20001001001001002525
Location: Houston
I compared the arms before I installed it. On my particular pump, the 4280 arm was laminated, riveted steel. It was about 1/2 longer than the 4609, but the 4280 arm still would allow proper contact with the eccentric.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
57chizler
Posted 2013-08-17 4:55 PM (#391859 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: RE: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 3262
200010001001002525
Location: NorCal

From eyeballing the two pics in the OP I'd say the 4609 is a 3-valve pump...larger in diameter.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
jimntempe
Posted 2013-08-17 5:27 PM (#391862 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 2312
2000100100100
Location: Arizona
So what's the advantage of a three valve pump? Higher flow? Higher pressure? More things to break? Just another way to get-er-done?
Top of the page Bottom of the page
GregCon
Posted 2013-08-17 6:34 PM (#391877 - in reply to #391862)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 2472
20001001001001002525
Location: Houston
.....this one goes to 11.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
57chizler
Posted 2013-08-19 12:29 PM (#392222 - in reply to #391862)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 3262
200010001001002525
Location: NorCal

The 3-valve pump delivers a higher volume....pressure depends on the spring under the arm.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
mstrug
Posted 2016-10-19 1:01 PM (#523819 - in reply to #391859)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5840
500050010010010025
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth)

AIRTEX 4280 Mechanical Pump Info
Category: Fuel Pump AIRTEX
Category: Fuel Pump Gasket Included Y
Inlet Count 1
Inlet Type Threaded
Maximum Pressure Rate (psi) 5.5
Minimum Free Flow Rate (gph) 20 GPH @ 1800 RPM
Minimum Pressure Rate (psi) 4
Outlet Count 1
Outlet Size 1/8-27 NPSF
Outlet Type Threaded
Package Contents Pump & Kit
Warranty Limited 1 Year

CHRYSLER 300 1955
CHRYSLER IMPERIAL 1955
CHRYSLER NEW YORKER 1955
CHRYSLER NEWPORT 1955
CHRYSLER ST REGIS 1955
CHRYSLER TOWN & COUNTRY 1955
DODGE CORONET 1953-1955
DODGE CUSTOM 1954-1955
DODGE LANCER 1955
DODGE ROYAL 1954-1955
DODGE SIERRA 1954-1955
DODGE TRUCK 1954-1956
PLYMOUTH BELVEDERE 1955-1956
PLYMOUTH FURY 1956
PLYMOUTH PLAZA 1955-1956
PLYMOUTH SAVOY 1955-1956
PLYMOUTH SUBURBAN 1955-1956

http://www.rockauto.com/en/partsearch/?partnum=4280

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/atx-4280

Edited by mstrug 2016-10-19 1:03 PM
Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2016-10-19 1:58 PM (#523825 - in reply to #523819)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5166
50001002525
Location: Lower Mainland BC
Hmm....I am working on my 56 D500 with the 315 Hemi and Carter WCFB 4 bbl carb . I am currently in the process of renewing my fuel system (tank has been cleaned and resealed, fuel line flushed, carburetor restored to OE condition (beautiful work), etc ). This is going to include a new fuel pump. I have a new Airtex 4280 and also a new Spectra Premium SP1280MP to choose from (one will be returned). Based on this discussion, I might have to return both and keep looking. (?).

Spectra 1280MP info: http://ecat.spectrapremium.com/prod/SP1280MP

It does list them for 1955 5.4L Chrysler engines which, to me, should be a hemi. (?)

Top of the page Bottom of the page
DepsilonD
Posted 2016-10-19 2:24 PM (#523831 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Elite Veteran

Posts: 788
500100100252525
Location: Buena Park, CA
56D500boy, if you have your original pump, send it off to Then And Now Automotive for a rebuild. You will be very happy. By the way, the Hemi's across the Dodge, Desoto, and Chrysler line were somewhat unique to themselves and not a lot interchanges in general.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
mstrug
Posted 2016-10-19 2:58 PM (#523836 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5840
500050010010010025
Location: Newark, Texas (Fort Worth)
http://then-now-auto.com/fuel-pumps/
Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2016-10-26 2:04 AM (#524419 - in reply to #523825)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5166
50001002525
Location: Lower Mainland BC
Okay these are my options for a new fuel pump for my 56 Custom Royal D-500

Left to right:

1. Have the pump that came off the car rebuilt. Note it has no notches and looks like the other three which all seem to be 4280s.
2. Use the NOS 4280 that I bought from a local FL person with several 56-56s (including rumour has it two 300s). Note the strange hack in the pump body and the shorter pivot/lever arm (still within the wear zone of the pump that came off my engine)
3. Use the Spectra Premium SP1280MP (I think the 280 part comes from 4280 and MP = MoPar??)
4. Use the Airtex 4280

What to do, what to do. (I am leaning towards No. 2, keeping No. 4, returning No. 3 and rebuilding No. 1 sometime, i.e. I like my spares to have spares)







(315HemiFuelPumpOptions.jpg)



(OEFuelPumpAsRemoved.jpg)



(WearZoneOnOldFuelPump.jpg)



(NewOldStock4280.jpg)



(SpectraPremiumSP1280MP.jpg)



(AirTex4280.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments 315HemiFuelPumpOptions.jpg (217KB - 55 downloads)
Attachments OEFuelPumpAsRemoved.jpg (169KB - 59 downloads)
Attachments WearZoneOnOldFuelPump.jpg (210KB - 63 downloads)
Attachments NewOldStock4280.jpg (192KB - 52 downloads)
Attachments SpectraPremiumSP1280MP.jpg (173KB - 59 downloads)
Attachments AirTex4280.jpg (189KB - 56 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
58coronet
Posted 2016-10-31 5:51 PM (#524918 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps


Veteran

Posts: 104
100
Everyone, please be aware that the Hot Heads adapter / LA fuel pump WILL NOT work on a Dodge based hemi/poly without grinding away quite a bit of the pump casting at the top of the engine mating surface area. Reason is the shape of the engine casting in this area causes interference. I made it work for my 325 by doing this, but would only consider it a short term solution until the original pump is rebuilt, for this reason.
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Powerflite
Posted 2016-10-31 6:48 PM (#524929 - in reply to #524918)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5798
5000500100100252525
Location: So. California
I didn't have that kind of issue when I put it on the 315 poly in my '57 truck. It does get close, but I got it in there without too much difficulty.



('57DodgeFuelPump.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments '57DodgeFuelPump.jpg (124KB - 63 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2016-10-31 7:24 PM (#524933 - in reply to #524419)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5166
50001002525
Location: Lower Mainland BC
I've installed the NOS 4280 fuel pump. On temporary basis, I am going to run two Fram G2 plastic fuel filters - one before the pump to catch any remaining crud in the fuel line between the newly refurb'd fuel tank and the fuel pump and the second one between the fuel pump and the restored WCFB carb. This will all change once I am confident that the fuel system is clean (enough).

I am going to temporary run a barbed fitting on the fuel pump discharge. I want to have this pointed straight up. I tried to find a brass male/female NPT "Street" Elbow but came up dry in two local autoparts stores and one hardware store. Ended up going to a pluming wholesaler and bought a bronze Street elbow (rated to 150 psi - should be fine). I know its not "Period Correct", etc. but it will work in the short term.

The selected carb that I installed yesterday:



The selected fitting (try not to laugh too hard) (the male NPT will go into the FP discharge and an NPT/Barb hose fitting will go into the female receiver end):



Edited by 56D500boy 2016-10-31 7:27 PM




(StreetElbow.JPG)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments StreetElbow.JPG (37KB - 57 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
56D500boy
Posted 2016-11-02 4:27 PM (#525109 - in reply to #524933)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert 5K+

Posts: 5166
50001002525
Location: Lower Mainland BC
56D500boy - 2016-10-31 7:24 PM I am going to temporary run a barbed fitting on the fuel pump discharge. I want to have this pointed straight up. I tried to find a brass male/female NPT "Street" Elbow but came up dry in two local autoparts stores and one hardware store. Ended up going to a pluming wholesaler and bought a bronze Street elbow (rated to 150 psi - should be fine). I know its not "Period Correct", etc. but it will work in the short term. The selected fitting (try not to laugh too hard) (the male NPT will go into the FP discharge and an NPT/Barb hose fitting will go into the female receiver end):


This job would be way easier if I didn't have CRS (Can't remember sh*t). I looked all day yesterday for the street elbow that I bought on Monday. Only after I went back to the plumbing wholesaler today and picked and paid for another one (easier than wasting more time looking for the first one), did I remember where the first one was: exactly where I left it - < slaps forehead> - on the scanner I used to take this "photo". DUH. Oh well.



Top of the page Bottom of the page
hemidenis
Posted 2016-11-02 8:39 PM (#525128 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 3702
20001000500100100
Location: Northen Virginia
I found this one at carlisle.



(pump392.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments pump392.jpg (104KB - 49 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
hemidenis
Posted 2016-11-02 8:43 PM (#525129 - in reply to #391678)
Subject: Re: Hemi fuel pumps



Expert

Posts: 3702
20001000500100100
Location: Northen Virginia
I also have a NOS but not at hand unfortunately. it is already in the restored engine overseas. However i managed to find a picture of the original CARTER pump that was in the car, notice the one piece stamped steel arm.

Edited by hemidenis 2016-11-02 8:52 PM




(DSC03035.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments DSC03035.jpg (76KB - 55 downloads)
Top of the page Bottom of the page
Jump to page : 1
Now viewing page 1 [50 messages per page]
Jump to forum :
Search this forum
Printer friendly version
E-mail a link to this thread



(Delete all cookies set by this site)